courtnek

GOOD JOB THUNDER!!!!! but I agree, a two year is too young to be left out alone. Especially since they do "scamper off" as soon as you turn your back. Although, she may have let herself into the yard while mom's back was turned. that's always a possibility.

good grief, I agree with Cairn. Had he fallen down the stairs he could have BROKEN his arm, or his NECK. people instinctively grab someone who starts to fall, especially a child. dislocated elbow is a small price to pay instead of what could have happened if you hadnt grabbed him... when Kyle was little we had a wooden electric garage door. There was something about the noise that door made while it was opening that bothered me. I didnt know it at the time, but it was rotten clear through. I went out there one day and saw him playing in the doorway of the garage, and something just said "get him OUT of there". the door was making "squeaky" sounds....I grabbed him by the arm and physically YANKED him out of the doorway, just as the door came crashing down. It was so rotted it exploded into wood chips when it hit the driveway. mom's intuition? who knows? it would have killed him had it fallen on him. His arm was sore for days, although no major damage was done. the doctor was like yours. "So, HOW did this happen?" like 12 times. Like he expected the story to change. then "how come you didnt know the door was rotten?" because it was freshly painted before I bought the house. You couldnt see where the holes had been plugged.... I understand why they have to do that, but it IS aggravating, so I empathize with you HF. I couldnt even collect the damages for the door from the previous owner, because I "didnt inspect carefully enough" How do you inspect through paint?

[quote]Other breeds may have the luxury of being excused for bad temperaments or past abuse. THIS breed does not. [/quote] THIS is my whole issue with this. they should NOT. ANY ANY ANY ANY DOG CAN BITE...uner the right circumstances...

ok Free is a Lab Mix. I have tried: Gentle Leaders - she pulled out of them every time, when excited by a running animal. Halti's - same thing. Prong collars - she still manged to somehow choke herself, but it may have been fitted wrong, I dont know. I settled on a web no-pull harness. she sees what she wants, she tries to run, and the harness stops her in her tracks. If she continues to pull, it will buckle her front legs. that's how it's designed. She pulled so hard at first she fell twice. Got up, realized pulling was not going to get her anywhere, and stopped. Now realize, no amount of treating, distractions, or praise will stop this dog if she sees something run. She's a hunting dog. the chase is in her blood. and yes, it's a crutch, but a working crutch. As soon as she is in harness, she stops pulling. she will still try to choke herself on a flat collar. but she is not in training for anything, and walking on the harness is a pleasure. depends on what you want in the long run. Most dogs do not ever pull hard enough on these harnesses to force the buckling. Free is very stubborn. Laurel pulled once, realized she was going nowhere and stopped.

I wouldnt have had to be bitten. My parents woulda KILLED me for throwing rocks at a dog. any dog. and neither of them liked animals. (least, not in the house). Thye always taught that animals were ANIMALS and needed to be respected as such, and that cruelty IN ANY FORM was not allowed. (my dad never lived up to his own rules, but thats a different tale). My mom would have smacked me upside the head severely for having done that. AND she would have made me go and apologize to the owner of the dog. maybe not if I had been bitten, but she wouldnt have held the dog responsible. She woulda been PO'd at me for having "started" the incident. In a back-asswards way, they believed that pets were property, and children had no right to destroy or injure other peoples property. It wasnt til we got a dog that they began to see things my way about them, but still, they were firm believers in children being required to RESPECT OTHER PEOPLES PROPERTY. In their minds, that included pets.

well, as far as nipping. with some dogs (not all) when they nip, if you turn your head away and yelp (like a dog would) they usually stop and look confused. In doggie world, the yelp would mean they have overextended their play limits and caused injury. Instinct usually tries to prevent that. if they settle down, then they can be petted, praised and treated, but as soon as they nip again you yelp again and look away from them. DONT look until they have settled down. Before you treat, or praise, order a sit and make them do it. they learn two things. nipping is not appreciated (learned instinctively) and NOT nipping and settling down to a reward for obeying a command brings good things. it's kinda a double whammy, but it tends to work well. as far as begging. I partitioned mine off in another room with a NO BEG command as soon as they started. Where they can see you eat, but they get nothing from the table. if they lay down and behave, I then gave them some leftovers in their dinner. Now, they can both lay under the table without beggin, knowing that they will get some if they're good.

WOO HOO!! IT;S **NOT** JUST ME!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

OK Courtnek's NOT buying it... BIG BRAG! BIG BRAG! AND WELL DESERVED!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

in a lot of cases it is. Wolves in a pack often dont like each other..they may be vieing for position, or a step up the ladder...but the pack rules keep them in line. it's the lower orders that fight, while vieing, and not the upper levels who are secure in their place. had both been loose, they may have worked it out. One would have backed down, or a fight would have ensued. but leashed, there isnt a lot either of them can do, and they know it. since they werent in the same "pack" they may have just been establishing their places.

accident. the dogs reaction says it all. He KNEW he did something "bad" when he bit. He didnt intend to, it just happened. A dog can bite 5 times faster than we can get out of the way. THEY dont know that. they assume we can play as rough with them as they can play with each other. having bit X, Asim realized something "bad" had happened, from all the commotion afterwards, and now he's afraid to play anymore. the treats are a good idea, let Asim know its ok to play with X. Maybe change the game a little. ball, instead of hide and seek. hide and seek hypes a dog up. A dog that intended to bite, really meant it, wont feel bad about it afterwards. ignore the docs. They have a half dozen reports to fill out now, and they just want to make sure the dog isnt a threat to the child. I dont blame them for that.

mine is 89% alcohol, oil of peppermint and water. but it says "pure peppermint extract" on the bottle.

he said he has never heard of it, but then again, he didnt know anyone using it to medicate a dog. and yes, the stimulant could have been the problem, since it absorbs easily thru the skin. Most people cook with it, and dont end up with it on their skin. He suggested the plastic bag. so far so good. I can work around it, but I would be leery of telling someone to try it without this warning. OR on a diabetic dog.... I had a LOT of it on my hands the first night, since it bled thru the cotton ball. I am being much more careful now.

I have to agree. if the pup was fine until the "lady friend" moved in, and subsequently got worse, I would have felt it was the lady friends fault. How much abuse are they expected to take before they lash out? **I** was abused as a child. **I** lashed out, more than once. you can only take so much.... :evil:

if someone wants one of these dogs, I dont have a problem with it. I hope they have the common sense to NOT pay a "designer" price for it, because that encourages these people to keep doing it. I dont expect everyone to adopt from shelters, but I would hope they dont encourage these "breeders" to continue to do so by paying the (usually way too high) asking price.

My Lab pulls. If there's food involved, she pulls even more. That's why I use no-pull harnesses. I have no intention of fighting with her. she just chokes herself in the process. and I dont use choke/check chains. she'd damn well strangle herself. while the advice may have been well intentioned, I would have found it unwelcome. I personally dont like choke chains. :-?

I am a firm believer that dogs, like people, sometimes just DONT like each other. The lip-lifting may have set Bentley off, or the Golden may have been showing a dominant body posture that Bentley didnt like. Bentley may even have felt threatened. (hard to believe from a Golden, but yes, it does happen. that's why I HATE selling according to breed standards) they arent all clones. Goldens are "generally" laid back, and accepting. doesnt mean they ALL are. sometimes, they just dont click. I have seen this repeatedly with Freebee her whole life. and she's part Lab.... I hate to admit it, but there have been times where, inside of 5 minutes, I have decided I DONT like someone. just something about them that sets me off. I may change my mind later, after getting to know them. hard to tell what goes thru a doggies mind on first acquaintence.....

Riley is gorgeous, I love his coloring. And he has the typical "mischievious" look on his face I see often in Border Collies, like they're tempting you to turn your back so they can do something, ahem, "not allowed" :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

well, I had another one Sunday, although not as bad, and I used less extract and a paper towel instead of a cotton ball. I am now putting my hand in a plastic bag so none if it gets on my hands. weird....Laurel seems to be doing pretty good so far, but we havent had a household full of kids yet either.

[quote]And oh by the way...I foster dogs in my home and while yes I work with them to help make them better companions I don't have them completely trained when they walk out the door. Training is not only on the dogs side....in fact many trainers will tell you they are NOT training the dogs, they are training YOU to train your dog. [/quote] that's exactly what they are doing. and I'm sorry, but this thread has upset me too. a 4 mth old puppy nips, bites, teethes. You could have tried ice, or tough chew toys, or even a frozen washcloth. ALL of the above will help a teething dog stop suffering. have your teeth never hurt? it's the worst pain in the world, aside from a burn. I better shut up now.

I am REALLY sorry HF...truly. When you get that close to them, they're like yours. I think her owner made the right decision. as hard as it was. and I really like the snip of hair idea and the bows. mine dont have any hair to snip (well, I could get some from Free's tail, but that;s about it). I feel for you. ***hugs***

they're 3 mg pills I give her once a day, and then a little of the peppermint extract rubbed on her front paws. the extract, not the oil. you can get both at a Jewel Osco. the extract is in the spices aisle, and the melatonin in the vitamin aisle. It seems to be helping her, but none of Kyles more noisy friends have come by. One just walked in now, and she bayed/barked but didnt panic quite so bad. When she's really scared she defecates in the house. She seems a little bettger. I hope with time it builds up and she can get over the baying/barking.

that picture should be sold as Christmas Cards......SSSOOOO cute. Labs are generally so gentle, I love to see him being so tolerant with her. youve obviously done a good job with BJ as well. some dogs would not tolerate her being in their face like that. :angel: :angel: :angel:

Mei, MY OPINION ONLY....but Sam has not come back (if there ever WAS a Sam) and Primmy has once again turned this into a Pit Bull debate, for no reason. I, personally, vote to lock this thread. I hate to do that, I agree fully with free speech, but this speech, IMO, is going nowhere. I leave it up to the the rest of the board to decide. my vote is cast. :cry:

I wouldnt try to help her hold it longer at this age Terra. She simply cant. do what you're doing now, leave the crate open and let her go if she has to. she is obviously trying very hard to be good. the "standard" housebreaking rules are one hour for every month old the dog is. at 6 weeks, if she can hold it for even 3 hours, she is doing VERY well. Free was able to hold it for four hours at 10 weeks, which is considered VERY good. she was "denned" in the bathroom. yes, there were always a few accidents, where the papers were soiled, but for the most part she tried really hard to hold it til I got home, cuz then when she went outside she got treats, and ball playing. I took the papers out, and if she went again she got a dog biscuit and a game of ball. since she is small. it is sometimes quicker to housbreak them. but if you rush her and she soils her kennel, that's a backstep. dont rush it sweetie. remember, she's still just a baby. a REAL baby.

I have no pull harnesses for mine and they work really well. I tried the Halti's but both managed to get out of them. The ones I use have two legs with rings on them. a third leg with another ring, and a webbed oval. (they are webbed halters) the oval goes under a standard collar and sticks up front towards the head. the short leg with the ring lays on their backs. the two long legs go down in front, then wrap around the front of their legs behind them and then are brought back up to the neck. from there the two smaller rings on the longer legs are fed through the larger ring on the shorter leg, and then through the oval. this attaches the harness to the collars for extra safety. from there the two smaller rings are clipped to the leash. what happens is if they pull, the rings tighten the harness and it pulls on their legs and chest, not their throats. Having their legs and chest pulled against like that makes them stop walking when they pull. they eventually learn that if they pull, it's not comfortable on their legs. AND they get stopped at the chest as well. no damage to the throat, no gasping or wheezing. they just stop, cuz they dont like how it feels. Mine are both very well mannered on harness. Free still pulls a little, but much less and enjoys her harness walks.