cheekymunkee

Thank you for your reply's. This has bothered me greatly for the past couple of months & I wanted to be sure I am not being selfish. I jsut don;t understand how someone can be so cold & callous to kill their dog (sorry I do NOT call THIS euthanisia because to ME it is NOT humane) instead of trying to help him. [quote]Was it only women or did he become aggressive towards all people[/quote] Not really, once he got used to the person he would be a little calmer but he was not too friendly towards women he didn;t know well. Debby

Here ya go, theres' plenty more where that came from, help yourself! :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: Debby

[img]http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/5/5_8_5.gif[/img] :drinking: Debby

[quote name='Shenanigans'][quote]Actually, I assume that people HAVE been "actively campaigning" against the passage of this law. That is, they have been writing letters and emailing each other and showing people pictures of cute pit bulls. I don't doubt the ability of the pit bull community to do that. [/quote] If this is what you consider campaigning, then we obviously have different views of it, unless of course, that was an attempt at sarcasm, which really has no place in a serious discussion about breed specific legislation. [quote]What I haven't seen much evidence of, however, is the willingness of the pit bull community to actually lobby for and make the kinds of changes that are necessary so that laws like this won't continue to be passed more and more places. That, is, to support real substantive change that will effectively address the problems that pit bulls have and cause, rather than just to try to convince people that pit bulls don't have or cause any problems. [/quote] Please share how you've been connected to the Boston Pit Bull community and substantiate anything other than online awareness of lack of movement to do proactive work. I can safely say that in many places I have travelled and called, there are local and not so local organisations working at a grass roots level that really don't have an online presence, so if all you're relying on is that, then it's not much to go on. [quote]As to the animal control budget in Boston, the law they just passed requires ALL pit bulls to be spayed/neutered (as well as to have large amounts of insurance coverage). So I guess enforcement authorities in Boston think that they can afford to pass/enforce a law that anticipates monitoring all pit bulls. And maybe they feel the way that I feel about my proposed law--so what if it is only sporadically enforced?[/quote] LOL A committee that thinks that it has enough money to enforce this law, well that wouldn't be the first time. Technically in my city one is not to leave snow on the front of their sidewalk for more than 24 hours after a snowfall, guess how much that is enforced? A case of biting off more than they can chew. [quote]If it is only enforced when some thug has seventeen dog aggressive pit bulls chained in a backyard and is breeding every bitch every six months and selling the puppies to drug dealers, wouldn't that still be a GOOD thing?[/quote] The thug with seventeen dog aggressive pit bulls and selling to drug dealers. I grew up in an inner city community. Animal control was right down the street. Every drug dealer had a pit bull at the time. There were several "breeders" in the community, along with dog fighting rings, we knew the existence of it, but do you think anyone could find it? Usually thugs involved in the drug trade are fairly good at hiding their activities from the law, and certainly animal control. And I'm willing to bet that without assistance from a SWAT team animal control is not about to waltz into any thug's operation as you describe it, and I don't blame them! If it stops one or two people from breeding a year is it really worth it? No, not in a city, not really, because other irresponsible breeders can easily pick up the slack. Thugs do a great job of networking with each other. And in the end, what's the penalty? If they go through all the trouble to stop some thug breeding nasty dogs, is there prison time? A fine? They take away his dogs? So what, he learns from his mistakes, moves more underground and starts all over again. Your solution can work fine in the short term, for one or two breeders, but what about the long term? What about when the thug realises that Dogos are a lot bigger, or Fila's are? Then what? Is Boston going to systematically ban each breed of dog based on the trend? As it currently stands I'm noticing a lot less pit bulls on the street and a lot more "exotic" breed being bandied about. No one has yet to provide a solution of how going after one or two irresponsible breeders a year in the city of Boston for not breeding registered dogs is in any way workable or going to put a dint in it's problem with irresponsible breeding and dog ownership. [quote]Wouldn't it beat (by a long shot) not having anything that one could do to stop that person which is (I guess) your proposal?... Or is the current situation just fine with you? [/quote] If you want to discuss this rationally, I'll ask that you refrain from these accusations veiled as questions. You know nothing of my views and to "guess" otherwise simply because someone doesn't immediately agree with you is inflammatory, but since I've been on the forums since acmepet was born, I shrug it off. Heaven's, I might even agree with you on solutions or want to build on them, but this method of "the only good defense is an offense" way of discussing is no way to encourage open ideals and work on a solution. And if that is your true goal, I think you should re-examine your method, because you've certainly done a lot to alienate people who could be working with you. People who offline are probably doing a lot of good for their breed and this problem that you say is so near and dear to you. People who don't automatically agree with you aren't necessarily dog fighters, people who believe in irresponsible breeding or ownership. I don't even own a pit bull and never have. However I have a problem with breed specific legislation because I do happen to have a breed (GSD) that is covered more often than not. Believe it or not, I don't have one magic solution to stopping irresponsible dog owners. I wish I did! Each community faces this problem in a unique way to them. In some rural communities it might be as simple as shutting down one or two breeders who are breeding dogs for fighting. In a large urban centre, I'd say tackling the problem from several workable approaches. Outreach, education, something with a little more teeth than a bylaw animal control has to enforce, getting rid of markets (such as drug dealers-it's funny, we're more concerned about the drug dealers dogs than we are the drug trade LOL) for irresponsibly bred dogs (and I say dogs as the trend seems to be moving away from pit bulls and into Dogos, Filas, Corsos and Neos). Having real penalties for irresponsibly bred dogs. Go to the state or province have some teeth in the law and not just a bylaw, make it enforced by the police in conjunction with animal control. Consult kennel clubs of all sorts to draft this legislation. They all seem like large undertakings and I'm sure far more expensive than shutting down one or two thugs a year, but I'm in this for the long haul. If we can have an [b]open discussion [/b]on solutions, I'd bet that much could be accomplished. Anyhow, this is turning into a book and I have dogs to exercise.[/quote] Not much I can add to this except Good Post! edit: Primmy, why does it bother you so much that people post pictures of their pit bulls? On just about every post you have made a snide comment about it, why all the hate?? Do you REALLY think that in the couple of minutes it took us to post our pictures we could have made THAT big of an impact? Do you REALLY beleive we could have done something that people all over the country who are fighting BSL could NOT ? If so....what? Tell us. Debby

[quote name='HazelNutMeg']WAHOOO!! But... stealing... at a vet clinic? :niedowiarek: I mean, it almost makes sense if you were a dog lover and stole something... but if you hate animals, what could you possibly steal from a vet clinic? :o Man! I gota add that banana to my part-aye! :lol: :lol: [url]http://www.angelfire.com/creep/wittykitty/NumberOne.html[/url][/quote] Drugs & money. They stock stuff there that can get you pretty high & people will pay for it. Debby

I have a problem & would like to hear everyone's opinion. Please, speak your minds, I really need some input. My "friend" has pit bull named Doc, about 3 years old & from a BYB. They were inseparable, he had him since he was about 5 weeks old. My friend also had a female roommate (NOT a friend of mine) who he allowed to mistreat Doc. She would yell at him, berate him then ignore him, which in turn caused him to become fear aggressive & mistrustful of women. Enter new girl friend. Doc has NOT bitten girl friend but has shown his displeasure about the situation. He has growled, snapped ( NOT bitten) and shown that he is not happy about her being in his home. My friend's remedy to this? He had her put to sleep. I am absolutely sickened & appalled that instead of working with his beloved dog's problems he chose to end his life. This happened several months ago & I have not spoken to him since. He claims I am being irrational but this sickens me. What are your thoughts on this? AM I being irrational? I have asked several people & gotten their views but I wanted to pose the question to you all, I know the people on this board are TRUE dog lovers & will help me. Oh and by the way, almost immediately.........there was a new puppy........one that he paid big bucks for. Sick or not??? edit: sorry, fixing typo's Debby

It WOULD be hard to enforce, people would just go underground like they have with dog fighting. Even areas who HAVE enacted BSL are NOT free of the breeds that they ban. The people there take a much bigger chance owning the breed but nothing really stops them from doing it. The same with ANY law. I KNOW it is illeagal for me to drive 85 in 55 mile speed zones but does it stop me? The ticket in my pocket says NO. :wink: There are laws against lots of things that people do anyway, otherwise we would have NO problem with kiddie porn on the internet, people WILL find a way to do what they want to do. Debby

:multi: :multi: :multi: :multi: :smilecolros: :multi: :multi: :multi: :multi: Debby

[quote name='shads']Hazel Nutmeg: Before you buy, check out who needs to be adopted--they don't come any cuter than this!! [url]http://www.petfinder.com/pet.cgi?action=2&pet=3015711&adTarget=468doggeneral&SessionID=40db251952b9b2ca-app4&display=&preview=1&row=0&tmpl=&stat=[/url][/quote] STOP IT!!! I cannot look at any more puppy pictures!!! :wink: That is an ADORABLE little guy. Debby

[quote name='__crazy_canine__'][quote name='Sarahstaff'][quote]As much as it hurts me to say this, bans will be good for them in the long run. BUT I think it should only be in big cities where fighting most often happens[/quote] Bans won't stop that. Bans will only stop responsible owners from having them. The lowlifes will continue to have them, and fight them. They aren't obeying the law anyway, why would they listen to one more? [/quote] Ok, maybe youre right, well no, not maybe, you are right. Gah! Dumb people. Why dont we just exterminate stupid people and then the world would be happy! :lol:[/quote] I'm ALL for that CC!! Debby

AAAAWWWWWWWWWWW What a doll!! Gas IS very very very expensive ya know!! :wink: Go with your heart, it is a big decision & one only YOU can make. Debby

Thank you for those contact names & numbers, I'll get yet another lettter written tonight! Debby

[quote name='K']I just read that Isreal has banned APBT/AST/SBT and has a view to banning several other breeds too...so although I can not do anything about that now I can do my own little bit...as our next diving trip was going to be to Eilat...that is now cancelled...they will get NONE of my tourist money now...[/quote] I agree. By boycotting these places, I may NOT be hurting their economy but I am NOT helping it either. I am very particular about where I spend my cash. Debby

Here is Ollie dog, she was found rolling down the highway. A friend of mine picked her up, brought her to me & the rest is history. She just turned 5. [img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0UQCFAskZjT8QVsS3LLkNRkcLJ1G2X9G7Duj20hNYzG1ygZ7lccrbYPL1t6DShgbFWvU2xqpbddmOVEIxDZU!nBUu!Ry0tDVyANLnaG*GT5hxDLV*DBvpLk6pIB!peGWW/pretty.jpg?dc=4675475944918004681[/img] [img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0VACFAu8ayp5WcHq5udeF*ySri*mkPn6ASoNWgkAfAnRyjMdkX*7SEuFMkDSlPAW4pN*nN!T7mi2sIntPXCCscEsmiVvYDdu!zS!eN0TB8vnwYAPCVz11MdUHWUL6cjlm/olliexmas.jpg?dc=4675477149743512683[/img] Debby

There's ALWAYS room for more pittie lovers! Come on down! Debby

[quote]Did you also know that a dog aggressive dog is more apt to be child aggressive?? if not properly socialized a dog which is genetically dog aggressive will view a child in the same way as a dog - due to them being appox. the same size. Dogs with high prey drive can also view children as prey.[/quote] My dogs, as do MOST pit bulls, know the difference between people & prey, no matter the age or size of the person. Debby

Cool story! Debby

I have NO clue what mix it is but it is a cutie!! Congrats! Debby

You could be right, I haven't read the whole site, I was just interested in this particular page. Debby

[quote]You know how I often say that pit bulls are just a headline away from being banned pretty much anywhere? While you guys have been busy posting cute pictures and snickering about how stupid it is to think that dog aggression in pit bulls is any kind of problem that you have to worry about, Boston has enacted very tough restrictions on pit bulls in response, apparently, to just a couple of fairly serious attacks on dogs by pit bulls. [/quote] That's where you are wrong. We may have lost Boston but we WON Colorado. Also, I live in Texas, BSL is against the state constituion. There are two small cities that have a sort of BSL but if it were to be challenged in court I am sure it would be overturned. However, resisdents of those towns need to be the ones to challenge the laws. If I were to try to do it NOT being a resident of those cities I would be ignored since I don't live or pay taxes there. That is another thing I do to fight BSL, I REFUSE to travel through or spend my hard earned dollar bills in states or cities that support BSL. If that means I have to stay in Texas & never leave the state, so be it. Debby[/code]

When you begin to regulate who can or cannot own a certain breed of dog you are putting MORE breeds than just the Amstaf\APBT at risk of being banned , look at this list. Everything under the FIRST TWO colored dots is considered dog agrressive to a point. That is ALOT of breeds & you can bet your hat the government will come after THEM next. What would stop them?? Nothing How many people on this board own one of the breeds that is listed as possibly dog aggressive? I'm sure LOTS. [url]http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/combativeness.htm[/url] Oh, Shara, I had no idea you were so young, from the posts of yours I have read you seem to be wise beyond your years! Debby

The existing laws are SELDOM enforced so why make more that will get us no where. I don't trust my government enough to give them any more power over me than they already have. Our civil rights are disappearing fast enough as it is. " But wouldn't you rather people be licenced to have a dog than SO many dogs end up in shelters, dead, and abused? Rather then now even being ALLOWED to own a certain breed, you have to take a test first to be qualified to do so!" This will become a form of BSL & before you know it we will all be owning pet rocks for dogs. [quote]But as was said before getting the ball rolling is the hardest part. [/quote] That and getting eveyone to agree on what will be fair for ALL breeds & their owners. Debby

[quote name='Sarahstaff']The cape picture is actually Elmo, but here it is: [img]http://elmothesbt.homestead.com/files/fdc018c5.jpg[/img] And here's his hang gliding photo: [img]http://elmothesbt.homestead.com/files/flyingmo.jpg[/img] But Tully [i]is[/i] exceptionally cute! Here she is as a Papillon: [img]http://elmothesbt.homestead.com/files/tullion.JPG[/img] And just as her own sweet (hungry!) self: [img]http://elmothesbt.homestead.com/files/tullybeggin.JPG[/img] And of course, no primrose baiting would be complete without one of [i]these[/i] pictures: [img]http://elmothesbt.homestead.com/files/thehaulofteamstafford.JPG[/img] :wink:[/quote] Sarah's dogs are wonder dogs, there is NOTHING they can't do! Debby

[quote name='pitbulletta']Cheekymunkey...see..this is why I think you need to go to h*** :) I came into this forum because I love my dog...and I admitted I take her to a dog park..mind you this is like 4 weeks old and SOOOO dead..but since you bring it up again..yes I did take her to an offleash park...and I thought she was ok because I was trying to train her to be cooperative and behave properly with other dogs... Alot of NICE AND FRIENDLY PEOPLE (definately not including you)...gave me useful links and books I should check out on pit bulls to make me realize that they do not belong in off leash parks..however..you were the only B I T C H that decided to throw a fit and tell me how immature, stupid and amateur I am when it comes to pit bulls...definately not encouraging when you want to educate someone on a certain issue...dumb a**...well I AM SO SORRY PIT BULL GODDESS... And YES I was trying to get people to stop arguing on here...They take their hate to other posts and rant...ex: primrose and others...yes they take it to other posts that have nothing to do with this one and start freaking out on each other and saying "you're stupid" or "oh its you again"..personally I don't think any of us need that in here so yes I came out and said that this argument is absolutely stupid and useless.... And then you decided to start something else by saying that I'm adding to it and out of nowhere, that people who love their pit bulls don't take them to dog parks, specifically refering to me...I don't know where you are coming from, but you must be one of those people that is either really depressed about life and hates everybody, or is just a really annoying and b i t c h y person in general...anywho...good luck to you in life if you're not gonna change your attitude anytime soon :) YOU'LL need it! :roll:[/quote] Here are all of my "rude" posts to you on that thread: [quote]cheekymunkee Addicted Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 165 Location: nunya bidness Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 8:16 pm Post subject: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: SO I don't know where you guys are getting this "she's rude" and "if she's biting" nonsense..I simply stated that I take my dog to offleash parks to teach her how to behave properly..and its working just fine... Code: Today, what about tomorrow? How old is she? You will NEVER find a responsible pit bull owner in a dog park. If you don't think slamming another dog to the ground is not the start of a dog fight, you are very wrong. Is this your first pit bull? How well aquainted with the breed are you? Debby [/quote] [quote]Here is one of many many articles you will find about pit bulls & dog parks. [url]http://www.badrap.org/rescue/dogpark.cfm[/url] Your dog may be friendly to other dogs now but what if that changes? What if she meets another dog that she doesn't like? Have you ever heard the saying "Never trust a pit bull not to fight"? It is NO joke. Why take the chance not only with YOUR dog but with everyone elses? You can socialize your dog all you want ON LEASH where you can better control the situation Debby[/quote] [quote]Quote: And for all of you that think I am being irresponsible and ignorant for teaching my dog....I'd like to know how you all of a sudden became the pit bull experts....Sasha..that question is all yours to answer Uh, the fact that I have been a pit bull owner for 46 years. Oh & I do not consider myself to be an expert, just a very experienced & responsible owner Debby [/quote] [quote]Did you read any of the links provided for you? I didn't see where any one called you any names. You really need to read up on the breed some more. The people who are posting to you & the people who wrote these articles KNOW what they are talking about. Whether or not you have had problems now is not the point. The point is why take the chance??? You have already had one problem, what is going to happen if another dog attacks yours & she kills it? She may not start the fight but she WILL end it. Do you at least carry a breack stick to the park with you? Debby Back to top cheekymunkee Addicted Joined: 24 May 2004 Posts: 165 Location: nunya bidness Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2004 9:04 pm Post subject: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Oops, I see that you did read them, good for you. We are not trying to be rude, just trying to let you know that it really is not a good idea. You can socialize your dog with others ON LEASH just about any where you want. Just be aware of her body language. At least on leash you have some sort of control over your dog. Debby [/quote] [quote]This is a good site to learn more about Pit Bulls, [url]http://www.realpitbull.com/[/url] Here's another, [url]http://www.badrap.org/rescue/index.cfm[/url] These dogs may be more work than your average canine but they are sooo worth every bit of extra trouble. Debby[/quote] [quote]No problem & glad to help!! I'm sorry if I came off as rude to you but I am very passionate about the breed. As is just about every APBT owner I know. Debby [/quote] [quote]I think she IS listening & seems to be very willing to learn more about the breed. I thank her for that! Debby[/quote] [quote]Let's just let this drop. Sure, she made a mistake but thankfully no one had to pay the price for it. She is learning & is willing to learn. We ALL make mistakes, we ALL have done things & found out later it wasn't the best thing to do. Give the chick a break, she's learning. One reason we are so protective of this breed is that when something happens that effects ONE bully, it effects us ALL. Debby[/quote] See, I DEFENDED you, that won't happen again, I see the people who were jumping your sh!t knew you better than I did. Debby

[quote name='Horsefeathers!'][quote name='Dog Lover'][img]http://www.minibite.com/passion/images2/hottitle.jpg[/img] [/quote] Intermission: DL, isn't it you who likes Nelly? If so, click on "Snot In Here." Turn speakers up. Enjoy. 8) [url]http://www.bobrivers.com/show/vault/alpha.asp?Var=S&Page=2&[/url] Ok, back on topic. Pit Bulls... hey, what a dog, aye? 8)[/quote] I LOVE that site & all the parodys! Too funny! Debby