courtnek

I will send this if you like, but I wait for your permission. Dear Minister, the author of this email asked some of us to both read it and comment, and send emails of our own about this situation. I re'send it to remind you of its content... "Dear Minister, I write to you as a very concerned citizen in relation to the latest publicised animal cruelty offences in Rockhampton. I presume you are aware of the details, but I shall recant them for you briefly. Five kittens were garroted and dumped in a sack near an op shop. Four were dead and the fifth had to be euthanased. This cowardly act is but the latest in a series of widely publicised attacks on kittens, which began two weeks ago with the stoning and kicking of an eight-week old kitten at a Sydney railway station. It is feared the following barbaric acts were, and I do not mean to pun, "copycats". The perpetrators of the animal cruelty have so far been teenagers. As your Department covers animal welfare, I have no doubt you are aware that there are proven links between cruelty to animals as a young person, and later cruelty towards humans. This is one of the reasons I ask you to push for legislative reform as regards the Animal Care and Protection Act 2001 (Qld). Section 18 of the Act sets out the *maximum* penalty as 1000 penalty units or 2 years imprisonment. This is pitiable and I am willing to bet, if I were to research the court history of animal welfare charges against convictions, and later the actual punishment meted out, such punishment would amount to less than the proverbial slap on the wrist. You will recall the torture of kittens by Australian soldiers in your State last year, and how their relatively light punishment has set a terrible precedent regarding animal cruelty. Section 182 (1) states that the court *may* order the disposal or forfeiture of any other animal the persons convicted of an animal welfare offence owns, the animal that was the subject of the offence, or anything the court considers is likely to be used in committing a further animal welfare offence. The use of the word "may" gives too much leeway to the offenders. I suggest this is replaced with the word "must", which logically can be interpreted as the court having no alternative but to order the forfeiture of the animal or animals of the convicted person. Section 183 states that again, the court *may* order the person convicted to be prohibited from buying or acquiring another animal. Again, I suggest changing "may" to "must", in order to achieve the same objective. Section 185 gives the court leeway for mitigating factors to this already very tenuously worded legislation. I suggest that there be no option for broad interpretation as regards disposal or prohibition orders. Any animal welfare offence serious enough to even make it to court should not have anything like ss 185 (2) (a-d) as having being needed to take into consideration for these orders. Section 187 as regards punishment to a person contravening a prohibition order is also laughable. Section 188 (Review of certain prohibition orders) should be abolished. In my opinion anyone that has been convicted of an animal cruelty offence should never be allowed to own an animal again. I am well aware that there are issues which could be regarded as much more serious and immediate to human society that may be taking up your valuable time, but I beg you to seriously consider legislative change. Take some time to visit the victims of animal cruelty at the numerous animal shelters scattered across Queensland. Those who have no voice cannot speak, and it is up to us to speak for them. _________________ "Justice is the banner under which all Australians should walk. Justice for all good people. Not just for the rich, the popular or the majority. Justice for all." --Justice Michael Kirby" THIS is the part I wish to make comment on: "As your Department covers animal welfare, I have no doubt you are aware that there are proven links between cruelty to animals as a young person, and later cruelty towards humans. " I am not an Australian Citizen, but I can give you the names of two extremely famous U.S. serial killers, who fit this scenario to a "T"... John Wayne Gacy and Jeffrey Dahmer. They both started their "Serial Killer Careers" abusing animals. John Wayne Gacy was found to have sexually abused and murdered over 30 young boys, and Jeffrey Dahmer was a serial killer, sexual deviant, and a cannibal..... Perhaps more stress should be put on these issues than currently is...there is definitely a link between animal abuse in young people, and later abuse as adults. It's not just the animals to people like this... Please consider amending your laws. These people can be stopped, if everyone is willing to do so. Katy Courtney Chicago, IL USA

My very first dog was a Golden....Taurus...yes, I go for unusual names. they are great dogs when raised properly. Wait til you see how she responds to "bad days"....they are very intuitive, and sense moods easily. dont be surprised if she realizes you are sad, and insists on crawling in your lap to give you "lovies"...at 75 lbs.... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

free doestn care, but Laurel will either be nosing me, trying to climb in my lap (shes a foxhound, doesnt really fit well) and eventually will give up and lay under the desk...

p.s. I do remember the original story of the GSD, but I want you to rethink this situation WITHOUT a specific breed in mind. Just consider what for YOU (personality, exercise needs, stubborness, intelligence, loveyness, what is it YOU are looking for in a dog) would be the ideal dog. there may not be one that fits 100%, but theres bound to be one that gets 8 out of 10....hoping for 100% is a no-win situation. You will have to work on the other 20%... good luck

Ok, youve told us what kind of dog you DONT want, nowtell us what kind you DO.... 8) how much exercise (realistically, not by new-years resolutions) are you willing to give it? how much time per day? do you have a fenced yard? are there small children in your household? if a puppy, are you capable of letting it out every few hours? do you plan to go away soon, for an extended period? how much are you (or your mom) willing to spend on vet care, feeding, grooming, toys, etc? (bigger dogs cost more as a general rule) do you intend to crate train it? Now THIS is the big question, and the one you really have to think about. You said the GSD was not right, that it was "too strong"...please define "too strong"...strong by character or strong by strength? Look deeply and ask yourself if there is a fear in you towards some kinds of dogs. Lots of people are afraid of GSD's, because in the wrong hands they can quickly become problem children. But ANY dog, regardless of size or strength, can become aproblem child. What size/kind/weight/personality of dog do YOU think you would feel comfortable with? those are the answers you need to research, and that research comes fromwithin. dont choose a pit because they are now the downtrodden breed, dont choose a lab because the breeders say they are the perfect dog, seriously ask yourseld, without picturing a dog breed, what it is you are looking for in a dog, taking all of the above into consideration. with that knowledge, I'm sure we all could help you. :D

Roo, do you have Dogo saved as a favorite? If so, delete that favorite, go to dogomania using the search engine, go to dogomania.index and log on, then see what happens. after dogo was down for those few days thats what I ended up having to do. there may be a script string in your favorites that the "new" site doesnt like for some reason.

me either Mutts.... :evil:

according to the post, there was two bites. both against the sister. now I dont know if the sister did something to cause it, or if the dog just didnt like her...some dogs dont like certain people. Hopefully the trainer, who is experienced in this, will be able to find a good place for this dog. this is not a maul situation, or a seriously bad biting. the dog may be rehabable... I am not one of those people who think dogs are never wrong, and only people are. I have seen both sides of the coin. But I have also "broken" a fair number of dogs from aggression in my years, and they became good and loved house pets. Under strict rules. and guidelines. Guidelines that require someone willing to be strict and "dont jack with me" with the dog. once that is established, all the dogs I "broke" settled down and became lovable and worthy housepets. Some dogs just need more discipline, and more sturcture...

I too would lean towards allergies. I had a dog that had "fall" allergies and would chew himself to bits. this dog may not be chewing, but the end result could be the same. loss of fur. I would get him allergy tested.

I have a problem with "Who gets the dog..." yes I realize they are looking for the best home. but what are they doing to the dog? he goes to three houses, gets to somewhat know and like the people, and then is bundled off to another home? to be tested again? I'm not sure I like that... for the dogs sake....

very good advice. We cant determine what pets think about these things, better to keep them unplugged when not in use... now for a funny story. I work for a computer company. We had a guy call us on his cell phone screaming because his tie was caught in the dot-matrix printer., he leaned over too far apparently. There were all kinds of people there, talking in the background, and NO ONE thought to TURN IT OFF until we told them too? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: after being turned off, he griped about ruining an expensive tie...

:oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: fat helps me. I have these "issues" - dont know about dogs, but when I get bad I eat ritz crackers with french onion dip....always helps. Is there a doggy equivalent? or maybe just some fatty canned food once in a while, or vegetable oil in the food...

well, no foxhounds, but these two are definitely Free... [img]http://www.retropets.com/prints/P-108.jpg[/img] Labrador Retriever - Black San Retriever de Labrador Patron Saint of Suppertime - Black [img]http://www.retropets.com/prints/P-111.jpg[/img] Labrador Retriever - Black San Retriever de Labrador Patron Saint of Tennis Balls - Black

I think that depends on what the trainer decides. I also think a vet visit is in order, for bloodwork, but as long as its out of the OP's house it could be trainable and she doesnt have to fear it anymore. All dogs have the potential to bite. some dogs need a stricter and more structured environment than others. I want to see what the trainer has to say.

I think thats a great idea!!!

what kind of dog Delh1? little dogs generally live longer than bigones, and 10 is not old. Has the vet seen her recently? maybe something else is wrong that isnt quite obvious...

ooopppsss.....sorry. I guess i did read too fast, but I agree with your assessment. he shouldnt have been shaved without consent. :o

where is HF? I'd like to hear her thoughts on it.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

y'know what else is cool? that the Bloodhound won in both choices, the judges and the people... HOUNDS RULE!! (just kidding.....I had to say it, I couldnt help it really... (Mutts, I had to do it. I know you're not fond of them... :lol: :lol: :lol: )

glad to hear about the trainer. please keep in touch, I'd be interested to hear how she handles this situation. I am sorry you too were injured by this dog, and please realize, he may end up needing to be put down in the end. I hope that doesnt happen, but sometimes its the only choice in these situations. best of luck

I think you should definitely demand to get your money back, and report her before she destroys another dogs coat. It sounds to me like she shaved him to cover up screwing up the original cut. got rid of the evidence as it were. and no, the coat doesnt have to be kept short if you are willing to take care of it. I had a golden, brushed him every day. he loved it. it was like being petted to him...if he got bad mats that I couldnt brush out without pain, I cut them out. I cut a bur out of Free's coat the other day, because it couldnt be removed without pain otherwise. so no, this girl needs to be reported and you deserve to get your money back....

my Foxhound is a field trialed "champion" in shows put on the by local Hunt Clubs. Nothing as prestigious as the AKC, or Westminster, or Crufts. She is not perfect by any means. Nor is she quality conformation material. I dont see that makes her ill bred, she is healthy and has lived a decent life. Some people devote their whole lives to showing their dogs. As I said before, I have hear good things about the breeder that won the award, and 150 ch doesnt seem that high over 40 years. And like was mentioned, 40 years ago alot less was known about proper breeding than is known now. The science wasnt available to do the testing they can do now. we're talking 1965....color TV hadnt even been around that long at that point....so perhaps back then what she was doing would now be considered wrong, but at the time was perfectly acceptable because no one knew any better. As an example, back then cigarette ads were allowed on TV, and children were allowed to buy them with a note from their parents at the corner drug store. My dad smoked, and often sent us with a note to the store to pick some up for him. No one knew about the cancer risks from second hand smoke, no one cared that teenagers smoked because there was no proof yet that it caused any harm. you see my point? we cant hold her guilty today for something she did 40 years ago when there was no proof what she was doing was wrong. things change constantly over time. we cant look back on all the "bad" things that were done and hold those people responsible today. as long as they have learned from the newer technology and are practicing the safety standards, I cant declare them guilty of past wrongs. the only "crimes" with no statutes of limitations are ones where it has been known forever that the offense was a crime, like murder.

I have to agree with Edgar and the rest. By the first post I took these bitings as an "incident" that could be corrected with a lot of work, but if the dog is plainly hostile to any kind of correction or training he needs a handler much stronger and firmer than you guys, no offense. Also, the OP has plainly stated she doesnt want the dog around, which is not going to make for a good retraining situation. I also think this dog should be turned over to someone who specializes in high drive working line dogs, and who knows the whole story behind him. Either way, I dont think you should keep him, especially with that attitude, and around a 4 year old. I am sorry, GSD's CAN be good dogs when handled correctly. But now you need to take measures that everyone can be comfortable with.

Oh Izzy....hugs to you and your wife from all the gang here. RIP Tabetha...run free without pain forever now