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:o There is obviously a market for these overpriced mutts or they wouldn't be bred. Who is buying them and why? How can we re-educate prospective buyers that they are getting ripped off? And it's not about the money, as much as it's a complete scam. It's about the poor dog that is virtually an experiment, a cash cow and nothing more.

I don't think I have anything to add- all of it has been said! :D You need to be able to trust your dog with other dogs and its temperament is 99% [i]your[/i] responsibility. All dogs need to be able to get along with other dogs if you have any responsible bone in your body... what if one of your dogs gets out? If it goes and tears the crap out of another dog while stray then it gets destroyed and you lose your pet. If you take it for a walk and it attacks another dog without provocation because it hasn't been socialised adequately, same deal. And what if your dogs turn on each other in your own yard, if you can't even walk them together then what does that say about your breeding tactics??? You lose every way you look at it and you have nobody to blame but yourself.

Hear hear! :D

OK, opened it this time- thanks Horsefeathers. I'm kind of wishing I didn't though :o Where is the list of dog food? I am thinking more about swapping over to BARF, the more I read about nasty commerical dog food!

I agree with you Deep- all dogs started out being bred and rebred till the perfect mix was made, but how long has it taken and lots of purebred dogs still have hereditary problems. People [i]do[/i] see their pets as a status symbol and how much they paid for it will either evoke a whistle "wow, she must be a top dog then" or a puzzled look "you paid 1500 bucks for THAT, I saw one just like him at the shelter!" :wink: We already have so many different breeds of dog to choose from, do we really need another? Think of all the dogs in the shelters now, wouldn't it be better to save a life than to create more? With "hypoallergenic" dogs- I thought the Poodle didn't shed? Is there a truly "hypoallergenic" dog? I do feel very sorry for those who love animals but can't own them because of allergies... but creating an allergy free dog is something that could only be done over many years with a lot of effort to ensure that by creating such a breed, the breed itself was not beset with its own medical problems. Fighting dogs-people who breed dogs specifically to fight one another are those who have no concern for the dog's welfare at all. :evil: Miniature dogs- there are lots of those around now! (I would be scared to own a tiny dog, I would probably accidentally sit on it or something! :wink: ) And you are right Mei-Mei, nobody seems to be interested in improving the gene pool of the dogs- more the wallet. My point is there are more than enough dog breeds to suit everyone, if they can't find one after checking every available option then maybe a dog isn't what they should be getting after all.

I take Blitz to obedience- he likes it and is doing well, his only problem is that he gets bored! (I eventually want to do agility with him- but 7 yrs is a pretty late start...) He is beginning to learn how to fetch (for class), being uninterested in anything that doesn't have a pulse is an obstacle we are overcoming. When we first got him he was a maniac destroyer of everything but is quite happy to snooze in the sun now in his middle age, and catch the occasional rat or bail up possums in the tree at night. He goes for a run off-lead at least every other day at the local dog park, he loves that (maybe too much-where is that suspect "humping" emoticon!). He just likes being with people no matter what we're doing, so we can take him to a cafe knowing he'll be quite happy to sit quietly for a little while. Egg- maybe Duck is barking because she is bored or seeking attention? Have you noticed *when* she is barking ie. when you are not patting her, when she wants something....? :wink:

Horsefeathers, if you could post the link again that'd be great. I tried to open it and my computer crashed on me! (I think it has PMS tonight though :roll: )

Morrissey supports them, so they must be doing something right... :lol: Seriously... They are a wealth of information but can get a little too extreme for my liking, maybe they have to be to get their point across? They make me feel guilty that although I am an animal lover, I am BAD because I eat meat and wear leather and am not a total vegan... (I am all for free speech but do not like being preached at and told I am a sadistic bitch for drinking milk!)

Mag- I wasn't querying [i]when[/i] the right time to spay is, more that it should be done unless planning to breed from the animal. If you have to wait until the first heat is over, that's fine- you do have to put your dog's health first, I absolutely agree with that... just have to be extra-vigilant at keeping her inside (and her suitors out! :wink: ) I've got no experience at all with intact bitches, and was too young to remember when our 2 females got done... I support spaying and neutering, [i]when [/i]the right age to do it is a Pandora's box I don't want to open! :wink:

If they banned certain people from owning dogs full stop, we and the "vicious dogs" would be a lot better off! All dogs have the potential to be aggressive... as well as loving companions. (but I don't need to convince anyone here do I!)

I signed. What is this world coming to?????

Sorry Hobbit- wasn't having a go at you- I was just venting my frustration at those who believe that leaving the dog as nature intended is much better than fixing them, or making them better guard dogs. I know with male dogs they can be rather aggressive if not fixed- but there are some who are just as aggressive after the op. With bitches- I've never actually *had* an intact girl, but have only secondary knowledge (so not much :oops: )- if you can prevent cancer of the reproductive system by taking it out, then I'm all for it. My main gripe is with people who just don't think that their dog could ever get out and get another one pregnant, or come home pregnant themselves. Then what happens to the pups... :cry: So I really wasn't in attack mode- more not thinking straight (I need some sleep!) :wink: And the stupid computer still hasn't downloaded the AVA site, after 30min... arrrgh.

That is an obscene amount of money to pay for a genetically unstable mutt. I am in shock. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: (this little fella is getting a big workout today!)

Oooh playing with fire Hobbit! :wink: Any dog or bitch that is not intended for breeding should be neutered/spayed. To do otherwise is tantamount to cruelty to the poor animal that has to deal with the many health and/or behavioural problems associated with leaving the animal intact. Not to mention the owner who has another pre-menstrual female, or overly aggressive male, to deal with! :) Any dog can have any number of health problems, but surely desexing is a great way to eliminate some of them- and if we are responsible owners acting in the interests of our pets then they should be fixed pronto. Why do you think there are so many poor dogs being subjected to gruesome deaths in shelters worldwide- because people don't neuter their animals. :evil: It is [b]always[/b] the dogs who pay the price for our lack of responsibility. I'm looking on the AVA site but my computer is being slow- but if I find anything I will post it, if someone doesn't beat me to it.

Now that is weird... a Basset/Lab cross. I hope the poor Basset didn't do his back in while doing the Lab! :wink: (though I guess the Lab was probably the male, had to make a joke though). The same thing is happening here, not so much with big dogs but little ones eg. Maltese, Shitzu, Westie, Yorkie... Stupid people get ripped off by horrid for-profit "breeders" (though how anyone breeding mongrels could be termed that!), buying what they could get at the shelter for practically nothing, and they would be SAVING A LIFE in the process instead of supporting these irresponsible people. As long as there is a market for these cockapoos, maltipoos (or whatever), they will continue to be bred. :evil: :evil: :evil: It is ok to pay top dollar for a champion dog, that's expected because of all the work that goes into ensuring the betterment of the breed, in fact all pedigreed dogs should be bred for "show quality" and not "pet quality". But to pay the same amount for a deliberate crossbreed is appalling. People who do that piss me off big time. :evil:

:evil: :evil: Big companies are all the same aren't they! I really wish I could help but haven't had any experience with Proheart... I hope someone out there has and can help keep the bastards honest. (though I doubt you'd look to the Aust Democrats as a good example of how to do things!)

Absolutely- and if we all neutered and spayed, then that would almost eradicate the need for shelters in the first place, and we wouldn't have to see and hear awful things about how these poor pets are killed. :(

Ha ha, you're probably right. (at least you still have your sense of humour!) :wink: So... 6 mth Proheart injection is not available here (aust)? Only the 12 mth? Though it doesn't matter- I will make sure the vet does not use anything by Proheart on my dog. :evil:

So sorry to hear about your dog Hologr@m. I wish I could help you but unfortunately I have no experience with Proheart. Though the company name Fort Dodge(y) is an appropriate moniker :evil: :evil: Best of luck.

Gordonmom- wow, well said. :) I never really thought about it like that. Gotta say I don't like the dog's chances of *making* it to the other side, let alone playing! :wink:

Soooo.... why is ear cropping illegal in Australia then, if it's for the health of the dogs' ears? I understand the reasoning behind it (ear infections et al), but this procedure is banned in many countries. In fact if you go to this page: [url]http://www.keymasterdanes.com/crop.htm[/url] it claims that there is no evidence that ear cropping has any significant medical benefits, as there has been no scientific study on the topic. Is it therefore thought that the unnecessary pain it causes the dog overrules any potential health problems it may have later on? This may be strident anthropomorphism, but putting puppies through that seemingly cruel process for the sake of a slight health risk or a tougher "look" does not sit well with me. Tail docking still takes place here but more and more vets are refusing to carry out the surgery. The Australian Veterinary Association [url]http://www.ava.com.au/content/aboutava/taildock.htm[/url] makes for interesting reading re: tail docking and why they are against it. Oh and welcome Pets4Ever :wink:

I signed it... :(

Thank you Daisy! I didn't know that. :D

I got 65. 8) With regards to rats etc: what about setting rat/mouse traps or using rat poison to rid your house of rats or mice? It would be deemed cruel and indeed it is- but does your annoyance and disgust at finding rat droppings everywhere and teeth marks on food packets, not to mention it's a bit unhygenic, justify killing them? A friend of mine turned vegetarian again after finding a rat slowly bleeding to death in her house after ingesting rat poison, she was really upset about this rat's pain and her housemates laughed at her!! :evil: Just curious to see what you guys think about this. I hate having rats in the house pooing in the pantry, but don't want to kill them painfully either :( Though it keeps the visiting cat amused-he will stare for hours at the walls, listening to the rats running about :)

Hey Science Doc, I remember reading a few articles at PETA [url]www.peta.org[/url] which discuss the universities, labs etc. that do animal testing, and also the ones that have swapped to computers/VR type stuff, if you're interested... I do believe that there are humane and ethical scientists like yourself there but there are also a lot of them who couldn't give a rat's about the animals... just like pet owners I spose. :(