Nancy B

[quote name='pekecrazy']:( My 8 week old puppy has been fine until today except for not having a very good appetite. She doesn't seem to be gaining any weight and I have tried everything! I even hand feed her to try to get her to eat more. Today her little stomach has been growling and she has been acting like she is sick. She doesn't want to play, and just wants me to hold her. I'm wondering if mabe she isn't absorbing neutrients like she should? Idea's anyone? She only weighs 2 lbs.[/quote] Take her to the vet asap.

[quote name='Aroura']Lily is doing so well on her diet at the mo, she's on a diet of supercoat with a meal of blended veges, chicken necks, roo meat and liver a day which I make up fortnightly. She's so healthy, probably one of the shineyest dogs in town but making up the food each fortnight is going to be really hard once I start uni etc and I wont have so much time on my hands. I'm just curious for you guys oppinions on whether or not I should change her to eukanuba... the cost works out to be about the same only I wont have to slave away in the kitchen each fortnight grating vegetables etc but seeing how healthy she is I don't really want to change. Argh, I hate making tough decisions!!! What does everybody think?[/quote] If you do decide to change her back to a kibble you need to do some research on kibbles. Eukanuba is not a kibble that I would ever feed my dogs.

[quote name='bk_blue']Oh yeah, I know exactly what you mean. I would've trusted my great uncle's dearly departed Dobermann not to bite me over my grandpa's dachshund. This is more because Tessa (Dobe) was trained and [b]completely[/b] under his control (Tessa adored my G/U and went so uncontrollably crazy with grief after he passed away she had to be pts), and Tomson (dach.) not trained, spoiled rotten and allowed to get away with everything (not with me though!). And to an extent, in my experience, some small dogs have Napoleon complexes. :roll:[/quote] It constantly amazes me how owners of small dogs happily tollerate behavior in those dogs that would cause a larger dog owner to put their dog back in "boot camp". At agility trials I've had Min Pins, Chi's, and Manchesters straining out at the end of their leads barking, growling and snarling at my Dobes as I walk by. My dogs have been taught to ignore them but, I have to wonder at their owners. What if they do that to a larger dog that isn't able to ignore it? Do they really think their dog's behavior is acceptable? They must since it never changes. Of course, if a larger dog goes by that doesn't ignore it and "goes" for the small dog, it will all be the larger dog's fault. Drives me absolutely nuts! Whitney has never bitten anyone, person or dog. She has been bitten twice. Once by a Chihuhua and once by a Cocker Spaniel. Both drew blood.

[quote name='Marble']hey nancy b- is whitney the dog in your photo ? she is absolutely georgeous. i was out working the other day and a lady was walking her 104 pound male dobie, magnificent dog, i asked her if i could pet him and she said yes, i petted him and chatted with her about dogs and whatnot and as i was about to get back to work she started telling me how thankful she was that i was not scared of her dog (she actually thanked me for being friendly with him) and how so many people cross the other side of the street and pick up their children and all that. it was very interesting, he was a really nice dog. i did notice that he was supervising her daughter the whole time i was petting him and i liked him that much more for it, i would not have messed with her for anything. my brother has a female red dobie and she is kind of wacko, pretty dog but very jumpy and just generally a bit high strung, he gets the same reaction though with his dog.........maybe part of it is from the hollywood stereotype of vicious dobies ?[/quote] Hi Marble, yes that's a photo of my Whitney. Thanks, I'll tell her that she has another admirer....right now she's snuggled under the covers in my bed. We're having an unreal cold snap down south! :) I do think a lot of the 'bad rap" Dobes get is because of the Hollywood sterotype. Even I have to admit that a Doberman with alert ears up charging the camera looks intimidating. Another factor is what happend to the breed back in the 70's. Dobes became very popular and tons of folks who didn't have the necessary knowledge were breeding Dobes. Since those folks didn't know beans about socialization requirements or temperament considerations in breeding, there were many Dobermans produced with a less than desirable temperament...too sharp for the average person. Many average people were buying them and finding out, sometimes tragically, that it was too much dog for them to handle. Dobermans have come a long way since then but, that's a very difficult thing for a breed to live down. Oddly enough, Dobes are not that high on the CDC's dog bite list yet it's getting more and more difficult to find insurance companies that will insure a home with a Doberman. Dobes are also one of the breeds that American Airlines has totally banned from flights. Both of my Dobes are very people friendly. I also love it when someone wants to meet and pet them. The more folks they meet the more they like meeting people.

Oh yeah...forgot to say that the vWD DNA test is the least expensive test of all the health tests that responsible breeders use. That's probably why the albino breeders choose to tout that particular test.

[quote name='eggrolyn1223']Why would they want to breed dogs full of skin problems, vision problems,and temperament prob.s? :evil:[/quote] Money. That's the only reason for someone to breed for albinism. The albino millers advertise "rare white Dobermans" and the unsuspecting public falls for it. Fortunately, the DPCA has made some progress in getting word out to the public about the health and temperament problems of albinos so, the demand and amount of money albino breeders can charge for their "rare whites" has dropped a bit. Last year the DPCA took out an ad in Dog Fancy (to run every month from then on). That helped a lot since quite a few of the albino millers advertise in there. There are still a staggering number of these poor dogs being produced. That won't change until everyone knows that these dogs are albino, not white, and the health, temperament and longevity problems. Know what's really sad? A few years ago the albino millers were selling their "rare whites" for about the same price you'd pay for a show potential pup from a responsible breeder. The price has dropped to near what you'd pay for a pet quality pup from a responsible breeder. Of course, the responsible breeder does all the health testing on sire/dam prior to breeding and isn't breeding for a genetic fault. The albino breeders seldom do more than a vWD DNA test on their dogs. They "shout out loud" when they have vWD clear dogs. vWD clear is very nice but, vWD (a bleeding disorder that you can think of as similar to hemophelia in humans) is in a very mild form in Dobermans. vWD affected Dobermans almost never are clinically affected....they're not bleeders. Responsible breeders do take vWD status (clear, carrier or affected) into consideration when considering a breeding but, it's only one part of the picture. Cancer and cardio are the two biggest outright killers of Dobes. Wobblers (CVI, neck vetebrae instability) is another reason Dobes don't live long. A breeder may choose to go with a vWD affected stud dog if that dog has a lot of longevity in it's pedigree, has no history of wobblers in it's pedigree and low or no incidence of cancer or cardio. The albino breeders just plain make me sick. To breed knowing that you are inflicting health and temperament problems on the Dobes for their entire lives before you even produce them....disgusting!

[quote name='Hobbit'] Did you know that under "Albino Doberman's in the UK" (in the site that you sent) she talks about the Dobe's that were bred by Whispering Woods Dobermans (the site that was originally posted)? Did any of that make sense?[/quote] Yes, it did and yes I do! Whispering Woods is one of the albino puppy producers. I've got a whole list of websites for those folks. We try to keep an eye on what they're up to becasue they're getting very tricky about trying to obtain Dobes with good pedigrees to incorporate into their breeding programs. It doesn't happen very often but when it does it's pretty sickening. Bitches are passed around from albino breeder to albino breeder to breed to their albino "stud dogs" and pump out puppies. A male from good lines was obtained last year, deception involved and huge fuss, I think that boy started siring pups at 6 months. At this point in time all albino or albino factored (normally colored but albino carrier) Dobes have a "z" as the second letter in their AKC registration. The AKC agreed to do this to enable responsible breeders to track and avoid any normal colored albino factored Dobes. No responsible breeder would ever intentionally breed to an albino or albino factor Dobe. (The DPCA would prefer that the AKC not register them at all or only grant a limited registration but, the AKC refuses to budge on that.) I do want to make it clear that although the Doberman Pinscher Club of America abhors the practice of breeding for albinism, they do not hold it against the dogs themselves. Dobe rescue still picks theim up and places them. We do not advocate killing all albinos as the albino breeders keep saying, we advocate spaying and neutering ALL albino Dobermans. Albinism in Dobes was a freak genetic mutation. All albino Dobermans can be traced back to the one original mutant bitch. That bitch had a poor temperament, poor structure and all the problems associated with albinism. She and her offspring were heavily inbred to "lock in" the albino gimmik.....they also locked in the poor temperament and poor structure. Generally speaking, albino Dobes don't really look like Dobermans. They've been mistaken for Weims quite frequently. BTW, Dobes are not a long lived breed. Average lifespan is about 10 years. Some so live quite a bit longer and some die younger. The DPCA has a longevity list that tracks Dobes 10 years old or older. The albino millers have a longevity list that starts at 7 years old....and not too many on it even so. Yes....I can get quite carried away about this subject! :oops:

[quote name='Cheetah']I think that the way people react to a dog with a spiked collar (especially on a "tuff" breed) might also have a lot to do with what kind of neighborhood you live in. Like if you live in area where dog fights are an issue - you might not want to get a spiked collar for a non-aggressive dog because people might take it more seriously! Other than that, I think that they can look cute on some dogs as more of a joke or for fun, but if I see some teenaged guys walking around with a pit bull with a spiked collar...it kind of bothers me how they think they're all such hot shots because they got a "bad dog"![/quote] I really don't think the neighborhood has as much of an impact as the breed. I've made therapy dog visits to special needs schools, hospitals and nursing homes with Whitney for about the past 3 years. Know what? Some of the caregivers are still scared to death of her. It doesn't matter that they've seen residents with questionable mental capacity hit Whitney or me with never a bad reaction from Whit. It doesn't matter that for years they've seen Whit being loved on by all sorts of folks. It doesn't matter that she will happily do all sorts of tricks for everyone and is obvioulsy well trained. All they see, even after all this time, is a Doberman. Oddly enough I've found that either the residents like dogs and welcome Whit or they don't like dogs at all. None of the dog loving residents have ever been frightened of Whitney. When we're out walking some folks will approach but more people will give my Dobes a wide berth. My kids have leather collars, nylon collars and Whit even has some frou frou lacy ones and a rhinestone one but, because of the way the general public thinks of Dobes, I would never put a spiked collar on my Dobes. Of course, if someone tried to mug me, it wouldn't matter what kind of collar the kids had on! :) Can you believe that one idiot tried that once in a motel parking lot? Obviously he didn't see Whit at the end of her 25 foot flexi! No, she didn't hurt him...but he didn't loose any time leaving!

[quote name='DogPaddle']Did anyone see any pics of any of these Dobes or White Dobes on their site? I couldn't find any.[/quote] If you would like to see photos of albino Dobermans, there are no whites they are all albinos, go to [url]http://www.geocities.com/~amazondoc/albinism/[/url] That website was put together by a Doberman lover who also happens to be a vet. It makes it quite clear just how terrible it is for a so called breeder to breed for a genetic defect...albinism.

[quote name='newfiemom']First, you have to get them used to the clicking sound. Start with click and then treat so they get used to what happens. Then I started with a C & T every time they were in the heel position. Then with every step, then with every other step. I had them up to 30 steps on a variable reinforcement schedule. Then I weaned the clicker. There are several good books on this. Clicker Training for Obedience by Morgan Spector, Any of the the Clicker Training books by Gail Fisher.[/quote] That Morgan Spector book was one of the first clicker training books I got and I still use it all the time! It's just wonderful, breaks down obedience exercises into small bits that you train individually with a clicker and then string together later. Whitney was trained to heel with a target stick. Mason is training pretty much the way you've described simply because he was never good with a target stick...kept trying to eat it! :D

Actually....the easiest way to teach heeling is offlead. Whitney and Mason were both taught that way. Whitney is a superb heeler. I'm still fine tuning Mason. :)

Hey, I just noticed that now I have two paws! Pretty neat! :D

[quote name='Black GSD']I forgot to say before, lots of people use beef liver too. We used to boil it, them bake it. BUT, it will stink up your whole house. Smells REALLY bad. That is why I prefer hotdogs.[/quote] I frequently use cherrios to train at home. When we're out of the house the treats need to be a "higher value" or the dogs could opt to give their attention to someone/something else so I use hot dogs or chicken. If I'm training something that's particularly difficult or that I'm trying to get a very fast response to (a recall or flying over the A-frame) I use liver. Yep, boiled and then baked...yes, it does stink up the house but it's a great motional tool! :D

[quote name='bk_blue']Thanks Nancy, I guess I was talking about how I can get my dog to be 100% reliable with commands in a normal, authoriative voice. I wish I had time to train him that many times a day! I agree, short sessions are much better than one long session, but I don't live with him anymore so I'm not able to zip over to my dad's eight times a day to do training, unfortunately! When I asked you about how long it took you to train your dogs, I was referring to weeks, months... etc. and yeah, how long it takes for them to obey it EVERY time you say it and not when they feel like it. K told me that clickers were very good. Can you explain exactly what one is and what it does ie. how does it get the dog to pay attention...?[/quote] Wow, that's a heck of a question with no easy answer. It is more difficult to train a dog that doesn't live with you. I train Mason's sire in agility and I only get him once a week. I did train Gent with longer sessions. I would generally keep him for an hour and a half. I didn't work him continuously for the hour and a half. We took breaks, played, had walks, let him socialize with other dogs and people and just generally be a dog...and then worked in more training sessions during that hour and a half. I can't really give you a firm answer on "how long" because there are so many variables. The dogs natural trainability is a big one. (Note that I didn't say intelligence...a dog can be very intelligent but choose to be very difficult to train!) Frequency of training sessions is certainly a big factor. I think that how you train is also a big one. If the dog really enjoys the training sessions, they'll naturally participate more fully in their own training and should advance more quickly. The dog's age is a factor, puppies are more easily distracted and I think that you should let them be a pup for quite a while. (Yes, a pup with some manners but, I wouldn't want a "highly trained obedience robot pup"! With a Dobe that would likely crush the drive right out out of them.) One other huge factor is the experience level of the person doing the training. Whitney was my first agility dog and when I got her I knew absolutely nothing about agility. We took classes for over a year before I entered her in her first trial. Gent, my Mason's sire and the dog I only get once a week for training, is the second dog I trained in agility. In comparison to Whitney, Gent was ready to trial in about three months. This had nothing to do with Gent being more trainable than Whitney but every thing to do with me knowing more about what I was doing. Mason, the third dog I trained in agility, was both slower and faster than Gent. I held Mason back intentionally because, unlike Whitney and Gent, he went into trainning as a pup. Some things in agility can have a detrimental impact on a pup if they haven't finished growing (weaves, jumps, full height A-frame). We really worked more control and obedience for several months. Once Mason was physically mature enough to do jumps and weaves it was probably only a couple of months to get him competition ready. That's about the best I can do to explain "how long" and I know it doesn't really answer your question. Sorry! :-? As far as the clicker goes, it's simply a handy training tool. Clicker trainers teach through positive reinforcement. (That's the way places like Sea World train their aquatic charges.) The "click" is simply a behavior marker. You start by "loading the clicker". IOW, you simply click and give the dog a treat every time you click. In a pretty short time period, your dog understands that whenever he hears a click, he'll get a treat. That's when you can really start clicker training. That's also why the dogs are generally easier to train. You drag out a clicker and they know treats won't be far behind....generally they're wild to work and earn those treats! (It is easiest to clicker train a food motivated dog but, you can also use a toy in place of the treats.) Using "sit" as an example. Keep a clicker in your hand and treats nearby. Whenever your dog decides to sit, simply click and then give a treat. (Timing is VERY important. You MUST click at the instant the dog is doing the desired behavior!) You don't say "sit" for a long time, you just watch your dog and when it sits, click/treat. Pretty soon you're gonna have a dog that is getting downright obnoxious about offering "sits". They want that click and treat and they'll race around to you and plunk themselves into a sit to try to get a click and treat. Shortly after reaching that stage, you can start saying "sit". The command always comes after the behavior is learned. Some folks train in a similar manner but use a word instead of the click. Nothing wrong with that but personally, I don't think it's quite as good. Your voice isn't always the same even if you use the same word....there can be inflections depending on how you're feeling, the level of physical activity you're doing, all kinds of stuff. How is a dog to know which inflection is the best one? A click is always the same, makes it easier for the dog. There are lots of clicker training websites. I think I've listed a few on my kid's obedience page. There are also a lot of very good clicker training books. I'm a self taught clicker trainer and Whitney was trained for competition obedience from a book. Since that time I have been to many clicker seminars but, the books really did give me a firm grounding.

[quote name='gooeydog']Pros... -dog will quickly learn to obey the command in order to avoid the correction -prong collars, when used properly, don't require as much pressure/force to use a a slip/choke collar, and "pinch", rather than "contract" Cons.... -dog may decide that what it wants to go "see" is worth the correction, and barge along anyway -prong collars often break (you should always have a back up collar on with them) -it's difficult to issue corrections at the exact right second -some dogs will go into avoidance or completely shut down when corrected [/quote] I agree absolutely! A prong collar is simply a training tool. Used properly for the correct amount of time and with the correct amount of force they're very effective. My biggest gripe about a prong is that some folks call it "power steering". They're too lazy to do the training required and their dog winds up with a prong on for the rest of it's life. That is abuse of a prong! My Whitney was trained on a flat buckle collar, never needed anything else. Mason was a different story. I used a prong with him for a period of about a week to teach him to walk nicely with me when he was about a year old. Oddly enough although he'd been leash broken on a flat buckle collar from the time he was a tiny pup, when he reached a year old he became convinced that he could pull my arms out. I did of course try the be a tree" method and "turn and walk the other way" method prior to resorting to the prong. Neither method was effective with Mason. I used that prong on him over a year ago and have never had to repeat the experience. And no, I wasn't overly harsh with it! :) In addition to the other concerns posted about choke collars, Dobermans can have a disease called Wobblers (CVI)....a problem with neck vetebrae instability. There is no test to predict whether your dog will develop Wobblers although it does seem to occur more in some lines than other. Because of Wobblers, I will not use a choke collar on my dogs for correction. I also will not use a Halti/gentle leader. While the Halti is a wonderful tool for many dog breeds, a highly motivated dog like Mason is could quite easily hit the end of the lead running and "snap" his head around...just what we don't want to do with his neck. All of that said, I still would train a puppy on a flat buckle collar. My personal belief is that any of the training tools listed above (choke, prong, halti) should be used only if you encounter a real problem and a resistant dog. Training should be just that...training! Preferably with positive reinforcement methods. I would not correct a dog for not performing a certain behavior unless I was first, certain that the dog was trained to perform that behavior and absolutely knew what I was asking it to do and second, had the mental maturity to be able to process a command and respond....puppies are easily distracted! :D BTW, for me a "correction" for my clicker trained dogs is usually just witholding a click and treat. A "harsher correction" is to stop the training session....both dogs are so wild to train with the clicker that it makes a huge impression if the training session is ended early.

You may want to take a look at the following website. [url]http://www.dogbitelaw.com/[/url]

Oh yeah. I don't traing the dogs for hours at a stretch. I train in short session BUT, if I'm training a new behavior I may do a very short (few minutes) session every hour of the day! If I'm not pushed for time to teach the behavior I'd probably do 6 or 8 sessions a day. Heck, both the kids get a practice "out of sight sit or down stay" every night when I brush my teeth! :D

[quote name='bk_blue']Love the doggy treadmill, I should get one for bk (and myself... hmm new year's resolution: get fit again). Training dogs takes soooo much patience. It can be very frustrating to see my dog, who is too smart for his own good, be stuck in the dummy class at obedience. He can do everything he's been taught blindfolded gagged and standing on his head. It's just he doesn't do it [i]all the time[/i]. arrrgh. By Easter I want to get him to class 2... one step at a time... it's also hard now because I don't live with him anymore, so it's difficult to fit in time to practise everything. How long did it take you to train your dogs?[/quote] Hey, I had them put a larger motor in the doggy treadmill so that I can use it too! :D I'm not quite sure what you're asking about training. Dobes are highly trainable and I can generally teach either dog a new behavior in a few hours. (A behavior is something like sit, down, bow, wave, etc.) Making that behavior absolutely reliable under all circumstances is a different story, takes much more practice. Complex behaviors I usually break down and teach in sections. Whitney is more mature mentally so, she'll be reliable on a new behavior faster than Mason. Both of my dogs are very clicker savy and, whenever I get a clicker out, will turn themselves inside out trying to be the first dog to get to work.

You know, I was wrong. It wasn't a Hoytt bitch who made it into the Dobe agility top 20 last year it was a Kimbertal bitch....the other big commercial Dobe breeder. :-?

[quote name='DogPaddle']Maybe someone can elighten me but when my roommate and I did some quick amature calculations we came up with the figure of 30 breeding females (plus a few males) needed to live just below the poverty line (if no pups die and no small litters.) That of course naively is calculated assuming 1 litter per year per female (assuming all pregnancies culminate in a litter) and that you provide decent food and vetrinary care and a decent structure with limited heat if nec and proper cleaning. (If you get more dogs to make more money you'd eventually need to hire staff to adequately care for the animals.) So how can "commercial" breeders turn a profit and do things right?[/quote] I guess it's different in each breed. In Dobes we have two very well known commercial breeders and quite a few lesser ones. To give you an idea of the financial side, I'll talk about one of them...the House of Hoytt. [url]http://www.hoytt.com/[/url] About 20 or so years ago the Hoytt name was actually fairly well respected. They bred and showed their Dobes, not much health testing going on in the breed back then so they fit in. The father retired and the son took over the business and really turned it into a business. Dobes in general are expensive. A pet pup from a good breeder will cost $1000 to $1500. A show potential pup from a good breeder of an established line can cost up to $3000. The Hoytts charge even more than that! How do they do it? Well first of all they're very good at advertisement. Their website makes them look great...to someone who really doens't know much about Dobes or dog breeding in general. They tout champion lines...yes, they had champion many years ago when they showed in conformation. I don't think they've produced a home grown champ since then. They've had limited success buying Champion studs....once it became obvious what their aim was, no responsible Dobe breeder wanted their dogs in a Hoytt pedigree. The Hoytts breed a large volume of Dobermans. BTW, an average Dobe litter is probably 6 pups but Dobes do frequently have up to 12 in a litter. The Hoytts also offer various "extra training packages" that you can order right along the the size, color, activity level and sex of the pup you want. (Does this sound like ordering a car to you?) I personally met one Hoytt dog as a pup. The guy who bought him was a member of the local Dobe club. He consulted some of the members about training issues and to determine if he would show the pup. He was persuaded not to show the pup, it had numerous serious faults. It was also shy and had no special training that we could see. Wasn't even really leash broken. For this, the total cost to the owner was $5000. The Hoytts have sold numerous dogs to celebrities. I think that once a breeder sells to a couple of celebs, it sorta becomes "know" among celebs that "this is the place to go". Of course, selling to celebs also has an impact on unknowledgable John Q Publics who figure celebs have the money for the best so, Hoytt must be the best. Hoytt doesn't breed to the Dobe standard. They breed Dobes to be larger than standard. I forget what they call them....superior, super size or whatever. Dobes are a certain size for a reason. Standard size Dobes only have an average lifespan of ten years, larger than standard size Dobes have a reduced lifespan. Hoytt doesn't seem to do much, if any, health testing. Dobe breeders need to OFA hips (elbows are becoming common too), vWD DNA test, CERF, yearly full thyroid pannel, holter cardiac moniter or ultrasound by a board certified cardiologist prior to breeding. They should also "prove" their dogs in some venue....conformation, performance or other. Hoytt does occasionally send out some Dobes with a trainer/handler to get a basic CD on them so that "obedience" can be touted. I also believe that one Hoytt bred Dobe made it into the Dobe agility top 20 last year so, what does that say? To me it says that if you produce a large volume of dogs you will occasionally get a good one....dumb luck. Good luck for that dog to have been sold to someone who loves and trains it very well. Many Dobe rescues have taken in Hoytt Dobes. They are of the opinion that home screening amounts to seeing if the potential home has the money to purchase a Dobe.

[quote name='bk_blue']I think doing all that obedience/agility/therapy etc. work with dogs is amazing, shows how smart the dogs and the owners are. :D[/quote] I so it simply because it's fun to do with the dogs! I keep the dogs in agility classes year round but we really don't do that many trials....I dunno, maybe about eight a year. My dogs really love learing something new or working on something they know. We do a mini-obedience training session every night just before bed and they race me upstairs to "assume the waiting position". :D I think that training a dog to do anything helps promote a closer bond between dog and trainer. I also think a tired dog is a good dog and while Whit is a perfect girl Mason is still so much of a pup mentally that I do try to wear him out on a regular basis. Sometimes, if the weather is bad or I can't get to the training building I'll just trot Mason on the Jog-a-dog treadmill to take some of the starch out of him. He's very funny, loves the treadmill! :)

[quote name='Poofy']I think show breeders really come in 3 classes. You have level one, who is usually a family or some one who shows and breeds for fun. Enjoys the dogs, does what they can to do things right. Some have lots of money to finish a dog...some don't...enjoyment is their goal. The second level is more serious, the breeder owner, the exhibitor. This is where, in my opinion, that politics begin to set in and can transform a breeder/exhibotor from type 2 to type 3. The third is all about ego and politics. You have those who are and wanna be. Those who are will claw their way up on the backs of their peers. Competition is fierce, and there is no holds bar on how to get that win. Some have money, some don't and get it however they can. These people cheat others out of co-ownerships, puppies, stud fees etc...its viscious.[/quote] Yep, I agree with every word you've said. I would only add that the type 3 breeder also doesn't care about health issues. They will breed to what they think will give them a winning dog and if it means long term health problems or a shorter life for the dog they really don't care. :(

[quote name='pets4ever']Hi, I'm not sure I want to do that just yet, if you don't mind. Off subject, what are all those degrees after your dog's names? With the exception of the CD, are they all agility titles? I didn't know there were so many titles out there! Are you going to go after more obedience degrees also? How long have you been showing them?[/quote] The AX and AXJ are AKC agility excellent titles, standard and jumpers. The OA and OAJ are NADAC open agility titles, standard and jumpers. The NAJ is NADAC novice agility gamblers. (We don't do NADAC anymore, tends to ruin a large strided dog for AKC and USDAA.) The AD is USDAA agility dog. WAC (Working Apptitude Certification) is the Dobe specific temperament test given by the Doberman Pinscher Club of America. BHIC is the basic herding instinct test. TDIA is awarded by Therapy Dogs International to dogs who have submitted the paperwork for 50 or more therapy dog visits. Whit has more titles that I haven't listed here....most of them are agility titles. I think I'll probably drop her NADAC titles soon too since she should complete her AKC agility masters titles this spring. Whitney was trained for the open level of obedience when I suspended her obedience trialing. Time was the factor....Mason arrived, I was teaching more agility classes and needed to devote more time to both Mason and agility. Whitney is six. She was a bit over three when she was entered in her first trial. I don't know how much longer she'll be doing agility. As long as she's having fun and is physically fit, I'll let her continue. I figure that when I do have to pull her from agility I may go back to obedience with her. I dunno, I really don't get much of a kick from obedience so I'm not sure. Mason has his AKC novice agility titles, standard and jumpers. He runs excellent level courses in training but, I'm keeping him in novice agility at trials for the time being. He needs to mature a bit mentally still and I don't want to push him. I didn't start trialing Mason until he was two and he'd had his OFA x-rays. Mason's trained for AKC novice obedience competition but, I don't see him going in the ring anytime soon. He's always showing in conformation at the time the obedience is going on. Oh yeah, although I have a handler to show Mason I've done all of his conformation training myself. :) I have been training both Mason and Whitney in tracking. It's tough going...both finding the time and finding new places to lay tracks.

Hi Annsley and welcome! :D I'm pretty new here myself. I'm really enjoying these boards and I'm sure you will too.

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