Toby is driving me nuts!!!

[Crystal]

Ok I will start off by saying I love my dog, but he is driving me nuts. 80% of the time he goes potty where and when I tell him too, but the other 20% he waits until I walk out of the room, right after he just went pee and pee's in the floor. It always runs towards his back paws, pee prints all acroos the hardwood floor. This morning he went and poo'd by the door and then started to eat it.....ewwwwwww gross. He constantly bites everything, feet, couch, table. He got his lower jaw stuck in the crate door trying to bite my daughter through it. He goes 5 hours at night not needing to potty. Before leaving I makes sure he goes, but the mintue we leave, if only gone 5 minutes he poo's in the crate. He has had 5 baths in 1 week. Yesterday was the first day I could get him to go outside. He hates outside, the cold I think, but yesterday it was about 50 so he went out to romp around the yard. He stays right on my heels, I almost stepped on his head. I have bite marks all over my ankles, I have yelped, screamed, pushed him away, offered his toys to chew on. Nothing seems to work. All I can do is put him the crate and calm him too. I guess it's the Lab in him, he gets really excited. Then there is the husky side, he is so cautious. My family came by to see him and he wouldn't come out ot the crate. He doesn't go near my husband, and when he heard a 4 wheeler go by yesterday when we were outside he cowered under the car. Ok, I just needed to vent. I love him like crazy, but I might lose my mind. I think dogs are like kids, they do things just to annoy you. I mean come on, poop sure can't taste good, but you would think it does, he was tosing it around and picking it back up like it was a toy. ewww gross. It kills me to think about it.

Anyway is there anything I am not doing when he bites? I yelp, close his mouth, tell him no, give him a toy and he comes right back to bite me. If it gets too bad he goes in the crate for a cool down session. My kids are terriffied of the floor when Toby is out of the crate. They run and jump on the couch. It is funny to see the little pup barking and growling and my 6 year old who is 20 times his size. My son climbs all over me trying to get away from him. I need help. I know biting now will lead to problems later, and poop eating is just nasty!

[pyrless]

:D oh my, you have a full-on case of the puppy blues! we have probably all been there, and i can tell you from personal experience that everything you are going thru is completely normal! And i can also tell you that it WILL stop and it WILL get better and you WILL look back on this and laugh. As far as the biting goes, try pressing your thumb down firmly inside his bottom jaw and saying "NO". Also, Bitter Apple works for hands and feet. Unfortunately, puppies do not think poop tastes nasty...you might want to check with your vet on that one. Hang in there, and feel free to vent!

[Crystal]

Thank you for letting me vent. The last dog we had was not so nuts, Toby is a total nut job. I was thinking of getting a tie out so he could spend some time in the yard, but I was wondering if that was safe until he has all his shots. He has 1 week left before he can get his first ones. Any help?

[pyrless]

Usually that will be okay as long as he doesn't come into contact with any other dogs. Remember though that with a pup that small you have to supervise any time on the tie-out, as you already know, they get into trouble so fast! Our first dog was like this, absolutely nuts, headstrong, wouldn't do ANYTHING you wanted him to, wouldn't cuddle (he actually grunted when you tried to hold him) ate a carpet, a love seat, part of the garage and about 86 pairs of socks... :drinking: Just remember, and I promise this, it DOES get better!

[Crystal]

Yeah I know he needs to be supervised. Our yard is not fenced, there is not a lot of traffic, but I still don't want him anywhere near the road. The one thing that doesn't fit in with the rest of his actions is if you pick him up he goes totally lovey. I mean completely submissive. He sticks his nose in my neck and doesn't move. He will lay on the couch and cuddle, briefly, but as long as I am standing and holding him he gives in. I guess he does know I am incharge. It doesn't help any for him to be nuts when I am sick. My stomach hurts, I have a sinus infection, and now my neck hurts really bad. Maybe he will behave the rest of the day. Probably not! and you promise it will get better??? :)

[pyrless]

I PROMISE!!!!! :D
I love how he is a little love bug, that is so cute! After he is vaccinated and you can take him to PetSmart and dog parks he won't be so scared of everything too. Have your husband give Toby extragood treats every time he interacts with him, that should go a long way towards making them friends!
When we first got Taz (the crazy puppy, aptly named, I might add) I cried daily. I don 't have kids and this was my first puppy-raising experience and I was so overwhelmed it was ridiculous (and you know, us women of the house ALWAYS do all of the work! :) ) I talked to someone who had alot of experience with Elkhounds and she said the key is to be more stubborn than they are, which I found to be excellent advice, even as the ten pound ball of fluff was munching on the coffee table...
When we got Sasha (the Pyr in my avatar) she was easy, laid back and extremely receptive, never touched anything with her mouth she wasn't supposed to. Which is good 'cause i don't think i could have gone through that again!
Taz, by the way, is now 3 and very well behaved, very smart, very protective and loyal, and has finally learned how to cuddle!

[Crystal]

It is very reasurring to hear that your disaster turned out well. I have 2 kids, so I guess it makes it a little easier. Not to mention when the kids drive me nuts, I let Toby out of the crate and they can't leave the couch!!!


Toby is still having potty accidents, and I know he knows not to do it. He tries to hide from me. Then if he sees me looking he stops in mid pee and runs. I have a head ache from chasing him around all day going no don't pee there. He was doing wonderful until today. I don't know what the deal is?

[CincoandDahlilasgirl]

well all i can say is good luck

[pyrless]

well, he is probably feeling comfortable in your house and letting that personality come out! Housetraining can sometimes be a bitch, to put it quite bluntly. I find that confining the dog to a linoleum-floored room when you can't watch him every second (and who can!) helps, use baby gates, for example. That way you are not chasing him constantly. Paper training helps too. Put the paper by the door where he goes out. When you see him starting to squat, put him on the paper and go nuts praising him. You can even move the paper outside too. Get him used to his crate in small increments, so you can use that too. An 8-week old puppy needs to pee every two hours or so, especially right after eating, playing and waking up. It will take anywhere from a month to two for him to "get it", and remember his bladder is still very tiny! Eventually they really do prefer the grass. It kind of clicks one day. I know you think I am nuts right now, but trust me!!! :D Just be confident in your alpha-ness and keep doing what you are doing. Oh, and get some Nature's Miracle for the accidents-it is a godsend. It neutralizes the odor so Toby won't be as inclined to use that spot again.

[Crystal]

The great thing is we don't have carpet. Hardwood floors so accidents are pretty easy to deal with, unless he uses the rug by the front door. I had a big rug that covered the middle of the room but I took it out. I was putting gates up to keep him in the living room, but I discovered he refuses to leave the room. We can all go to the kitchen, Toby will just stand in the door way and look at us. Today it is warm so I have been taking him outside to go potty. Much better!!! He goes instantly, he even already picked his favorite spot. Just the spot we wanted too. As long as it is warm he will go outside. When it's cold he just whines. I have been using newspaper. He was dragging them around though, so I put them inside an old litter box I had. Works terrific. Right now he is under the couch growling and barking. He's a loon. He know's what no means though. When he goes towards the front door rug sniffing I go no Toby. He stops and turns around real quick. So things are better than they were this morning. We have to go grocery shopping this evening, so I hope he sleeps the whole time. I am tired of cleaning out a messy crate!

Thanks for the help. You made me feel a lot better.

[courtnek]

puppies are a pain in the arse, and lab puppies are no exception.....in fact they can be worse because of the huge energy requirements.

for biting, I found with Free (part lab) that a squirt of bitter apple straight onto her tongue, after a loud and angry NNNOOOOOOO!!!!!!! got her to stop. she was not responding to positive reinforcement during her biting stage. I tried the yelp, the head turn, the "bad dog" and head turn...nada.
she kept nipping. I knew she was teething, so after I squirted her with bitter apple, I would make her lay down, I would then call her, tell her to sit, and give her ice cubes wrapped up in a towel. she would chew on them and it eased the teething pain somewhat. dont give the cubes until after she has served her "down" session, or she may see them as a reward for biting.

[Crystal]

sounds just like Toby, he doesn't care, just keeps nipping

[pyrless]

i am glad you are feeling a little better-keep us posted! courtnek is right, sometimes they do not respond to the positive reinforcement when biting, and i don't know any dog that likes bitter apple! :D

[Crystal]

Well he is acting a bit better now. I discovered if I blow in his face when he nips then he runs away. That stops it real quick. When he comes back he is a lot calmer. Yesterday he took an extreme hyper spell he was running around mouth wide open bitting everything in his path. The more I told him to stop the worse it got. It took me a while to catch him, when I did he bite my nose. He needed a major cool down, so he spent quality time with the crate. He chewed his rope bone and finally calmed down. It was hilarious to see him run wide open around the room, he can't get traction on the hardwood floors and he was slipping and sliding under furniture. It was funny, once he slid into the table leg and yelped, it wasn't comfy on the ribs. Then he ran to the couch and started jumping, I mean really jumping all four legs off the ground at once and his body stayed totally level. It was the oddest thing I've ever seen.

He really enjoyed going outside yesterday, it was 63 at one point. Now it is snowing and in the 20's. Isn't that nuts. Now he won't go outside.

[pyrless]

i guess that's the Lab in him! :wink:
Yeah, they are funny to watch, if you have a sense of humor about it like you do, you are gonna be just fine.

[Crystal]

He actually went out in the snow. I am totally blown away. I went and sat him on the porch and he jumped off and stuck his nose in the snow. It was really funny. He didn't stay but a couple of minutes, but long enough to wee! He's a nut, I spend most of my day laughing at him. He does laps around the living room. When I get down to look under the couch to see where he is he lunges at me. I feel better now, he is sleeping a lot better at night, last night he went in his crate at 9 and didn't wake me up until 4:30. I was shocked. Man did he ever wee after that sleep.

[pyrless]

hee hee! so the husky side comes out! :wink:

[Crystal]

yeah. and which side is pure stubborness. Ok he was doing wonderful going outside going potty. Now he won't go off the porch just goes right infront of the door. :x drives me crazy. Then all night last night he would got potty on his paper and then immediatley run and pee in 2 or 3 different places in the floor. He is now going behind the couch. When I try to catch him he runs away. I praise him like crazy for going where he is suppose to. When he goes else where I say no no and pick him up and take him where he is suppose to go. Well he knows he is doing wrong I can tell by the look in his eyes. I think I have the flu, stomach, head, I ache all over. So after all this lastnight I am in a supper bad mood this morning in my frustration I threaten to move the dog outside permanetly. Then my husband say you just have to fix him. He meant fix his bad habits. Well I got to thinking. I can't take the peeing all over my living room floor. My son plays there. I don't want to mop 3 times a day either. So Toby has moved to the laundry room. It's not a large room, but plenty of room to play. I took the door off his crate so he can come and go as he pleases. He has food and water. I also lined one side with paper. The door is gated off so he can not escape. Maybe he is mad at me for the crate. He can come play in the living room when someone is available to keep constant watch, but I was losing it. It was the only thing I could think of. He is so stubborn. No one ever goes in the laundry room but me and I can stand having to clean that floor daily, but my living room is huge and lots of places to hide your business. Does this sound mean???

[pyrless]

No, it is not mean. Please remember though, the puppy does not feel guilt or spite. He is not mad at you for the crate-dogs are denning animals. However, they are also opportunists, and if he can get to be with you by crying and pawing, then he will. He's just an 8 week old bundle of energy learning to be houstrained, and like I said, confining him to a room when you can't chase him all day is definitely an option. He gets privileges when he learns house manners, that makes sense to me. However make sure he can see you and has fun stuff to do. Make sure you still take him out every couple hours to pee. It's also never too early to start basic obedience, like Sit and Come and Lie Down, and leash training. If he is peeing by the door, it could be because he is not comfortable with stairs yet, or just because it is too cold-I have a Pomeranian that does that when there is snow on the deck. I know what it is to raise a stubborn pup! It doesn't help that you are feeling like crap either. Please have patience, it does get better. But make sure you take care of yourself! :wink:

[Guest Anonymous]

well, it sounds like typical life with a puppy--as soon as you feel like things are getting better and you have things under control, BOOM, things seem to take a turn for the worse.

As far as the biting:

I have a presa canario pup--10 weeks old. Talk about a biter! I have NEVER had a dog that had the drive to mouth like he does. He is getting better--SLOWLY. One thing that a lot of people do not mention, but that I have found helpful is to take my pup and let him be around other dogs that will not put up with his crap. For me, this is my trainers pitbull/lab mix. My boy, Ares, spends 20-30 mins being corrected and generally beat up on for biting too much. The first time I took him to play, I could actually see his behavior starting to change. Now, it doesnt happen in any permanence overnight like that, but it has helped.

One other thing, which you have kind of alluded to, but I spray simple water in his face when he gets going. It startles him enough to replace your hand with a toy and praise him before he realizes what has happened.

As far as the house training thing:

It takes time and it is a rollercoaster. it sounds like you are on the right track. one thing I would change, however, is having the door on his crate. a smaller space appeals to his den instinct better. think about it, if he can crap in the corner and then move away from it, what does it matter to him. also, how big is his crate? it should be just big enough for him to lay down--i know it is hard to constantly change the size of the crate, but you can fill part of it with boxes or somethign so that it is actually smaller when you are done.

keep us updated!

Joseph

[Crystal]

Well there is a box in the crate to make it the correct size, but he has been pooping there anyways and the whining like crazy. He knows he can get out if he gets poo everywhere. He hates the cold and right now it is snowing, so I have to use newspaper. He will only go outside when its warm. I can't stand the pooing on the porch. There is only one tiny step down and he has done it 15 times, but not yesterday. My last dog was no where near this stubborn. Very easily trained and did not bite much. Toby loves hands and feet. He doesn't bite things, just people. He does sit, we have been working on the one a lot. He has it figured out.

Pyrless...Thank you for saying it is not mean. It kinda felt mean, but I can't have him peeing all over my living room. I think the problem was that our living room is huge and he kinda gets confused when he has to go. In the much smaller laundry room he is using the papers. When it's warm we go outside. I hope the 2 different place isn't confusing him, but it is his fault he don't like cold, not mine. It's extremly hard to chase a weeing pup when you are sick as a dog yourself. My daughter has been going in to play with him and I spent as much time as my pounding head would allow. He seems to be happy. He gets in the crate and goes to sleep and plays with toys, but he comes out to eat, drink, and potty. He isn't even bitting us as much since he is there, he just plays and acts more polite. I have honestly never meet a pup so stubborn...My hubby picked him out...Of course that's the deal, they have some secret thing going on to make me insane! :lol:

[pyrless]

I know, my husband picked out Taz the Devil Puppy and I felt the same way for a while-what a conspiracy! He works long hours, so I was the one that came home to poo and shredded newspaper every day! :lol:
I understand what you are saying. You just can't let a pup have the run of the house (probably til about a year old). And you are right about the large space. They are a lot less likely to soil a confined area, what they see as "their" area. But his bladder is still small and, just like a human baby, there will be accidents. My dogs were reliably house-trained by 4 months, but still in crates when we went to work because of the chewing on stuff.
It is good that he is coming out of his crate to go potty, though. And paper training is fine-we did it because we both work full-time. Eventually they catch on that outside=pee, cold or not. And with Husky blood he will eventually learn to tolerate it, I would think! You are doing all the right things. Four months of puppy pays off a hundred times when you have a lovely adult dog for a companion, and again, I PROMISE YOU WILL!!!

[Crystal]

Thanks for the reassurance. It's nice to know someone thinks I'm doing things right. Sometimes I wonder. Surely being part Husky he will get used to the cold. His coat is pretty thick, but he's a whiner. It's not that cold right now and I put him outside he pee'd and whined to come back in. Such a baby. I love him, even when he is a monster.

[pyrless]

hee hee! sounds like he is pretty attached to you already! Keep me posted, ok?

[Crystal]

I'm pretty attached to him to. :wink: I'll keep you posted on how it's going.