Training with a Prong Collar

[Cheetah]

Ever since Roxie was a pup, I've used a choke chain on her. However, after recently reading about how choke chains can cause damage to the trachea, along with neck and back strains when not properly used - I realized that I really needed to switch to something else! When Roxie sees something exciting or gets on a scent, she strains at the leash and I don't want her to hurt herself! Admittedly, I've given her a few good pops to get her to pay attention, and as a result she's kinda become de-sensitized to the choker. I know that the point of the choker was originally for the dog to pay attention to the "clink" sound...but Roxie has regressed :oops: and now it's become more of a power struggle! After doing a little research, I found that with training, prong collars are a lot more humane and safe than chokers since they distribute the pressure evenly (although chokers are humane when properly used).
The reason that I turned to a prong collar was because I've seriously tried to train Roxie to stop pulling (for example, the be a tree, and turn the other way approach), but she's basically formed a bad habit and nothing really seems to help. So I bought a prong collar (after reading how to properly put in on and etc.) and it worked like a charm! After Roxie's first walk (today) on it, she's done very well, and whenever she starts pulling, I just do a 360 degree turn and then we continue going. It seems to be working well on the first day with very minimal physical effort on my part, but i'm worried that she'll become de-sensitized to the prong collar too and then that'll backfire! I understand that for the prong collar to work, you must combine it with training and not just let it be a power tool. That's kind of what i'm doing, but I'm asking if anyone has any other suggestions for training with a prong collar and getting a dog to walk on a loose leash with one. I know I should be researching training methods myself, but i've honestly looked and looked, and although i've found plenty of general info on prong collars, most sites that have trainers that actually KNOW what they're talking about will offer a $50 video on training with a prong collar! Also, if anyone knows of good training boards to post this question on, that would be appreciated to!

[gooeydog]

Like any collar/control device (from GL types to no pull harnesses, to even electric collars), dogs can become desensitized to prong collar corrections. It would be a good idea to use the prong collar to control her while you work with her on keeping her attention focused on you. Why will that keep her from pulling? She'll be focusing on you (most likely your face, but some people use their hands) waiting for you to tell/show her what to do next. You can easily teach a dog to focus using clicker/marker training... simply stand/sit with the on front of you, on a flat collar and leash. This may take a while, so find someplace comfortable, as you don't want to be constantly fidgeting or trying to get situated. Tell her to "look" (or whatever word you want to use as the command for her to focus on you), then you just wait. The instant the dog makes eye contact with you, either "click", or say "good" (or whatever word you want to use to mark the good behavior), and reward (treat, toy, praise, whatever you use, though I've found that it's harder to reward with praise than it is with a "material" item). Then say "look" (again), and wait until she does it again, and repeat the "mark & reward" thing. Only do this for short sessions, like five minutes at a time, several times a day. Eventually you should be able to have her maintain eye contact for longer periods of time before rewarding. Also important, when you first start, go someplace where there are very few distractions, because distractions will make it harder for her to focus on you. Once you have her making steady eye contact for over 30 seconds in the "low distraction area", you can move to one with a few small distractions. Bagin the entire process again, starting with rewarding for just short "looks", and working your way up to longer ones. kepp adding distractions as she becomes comfortable with it, but don't move too fast, and if she can't focus with a higher amount of distraction, move back down to the previous level. I'm not sure if this was all that good of an explanation, but I'm sure there is more somewhere online about the same thing, all you have to do is look around a little :lol: . If you're going to be going to any training classes, they usually help you teach the dog to focus, as well.
I've never used a prong collar on a dog before, so I don't know much about how they're used, or the best way to correct with them :lol:

[courtnek]

Prong collars work well with strong dogs who have become desenstiazed to the choke. But the same issues apply - the dog will become desensitized to the prong as well, with out training. Mei's suggestions were all VERY good. Your pup needs to be trained to pay attyention to you - NO MATER WHAT - and a little bit of dominance training wont hurt either. Dominance training involves making the dog understand that YOU are the alpha.... they do NOT walk ahead of you, ever. especially during training. The prong collar will help in the begining, as yuu already noticed, because it curbs them from pulling. As simple as it sounds, teach him to heel. Under those circumstances, he never walks ahead of you. In a pack situation, no one walks ahead of the alpha. He leads, they follow.

In the heel mode, you can use your 180 degree turn tactic to youR advantage during training. When he tries to get ahead of you, stop, order him to heel, and turn 180 degrees and go the other way. The prong collar will help in this situatin because it makes it harder to pull. EVERY TIME
he tries to get ahead, order him to heel and turn. Eventually, he will realize that his world will be turned upside down every time he pulls ahead. Once he understands that, the rest is easy. It's just getting THAT down that takes time.

Once he has learned "his place" you will find the prong collar unnecessary.
A simple leather collar will do. I have web collars on mine, to cut down on fur displacement (web collars breathe) but I had to train them using chokes...

[Cheetah]

Roxie already knows how to heel and "watch me". However, although at one point (fresh out of obedience class three years ago) she could watch me for about 30 seconds....admittedly, I haven't used that command in a long while and she most likely can't hold it for more than a few seconds. I like the heel idea because instead of using force to turn her, i'm establishing my dominance and more gently turning her around. I'll have to start practice this for short periods of time at first, since it'll get very tiring bringing her around to a heel every other step...but hopefully she'll learn eventually! I think i'll also work on Roxie's watch me command again since she hasn't used it in awhile - shouldn't be too hard. Combining the 180 degree heel and the watch me sounds like a good start to keeping her attention on me and stopping her from pulling. Great suggestions, keep 'em coming! :)

[mouseatthebusstop]

I have the same problem with Paddy and Gladis, I tried every time the dog pulls stop wait for the leash to go slack before starting again. It was very hard with both of them together. next a harness worked for a while with Paddy, I had to put Gladis back on a normal coller she still pulled her skin was sore where the harness was. I have found now that when I take them both out on normal collers when one starts to pull give a little tug on the lead and say nicely. If they still pull say "I'll fall" like I mean it. We are getting there. I can not walk them on their own it would take too long. :)