These dogs

[Guest Anonymous]

avaloniaboerboele napisał(a):

What beautifull dogs - i did not know they crop mastiff's ears??

In countries where cropping of the ears is permitted. They crop the mastino's ears so that they look the the old Roman war dogs whom the Neo resembles.

[Guest Anonymous]

what is the bite psi of these dogs?

[gooeydog]

:o 1,000,000 PSI... :roll: With 6 sets of fangs... It doesn't matter, no decent breeder would sell you one anyway. :lol:

[deepseasnake]

that was a fairly rare and ridiculous question, you must be one of those idiot things I've read about

I didnt read those articles posted, from what was said do I assume that it was about a neo who killed someone and people screaming "man eater" because of it, is that about right?
should I read the article or is it basicaly another piece of anti dog bias sh!t?

I dont like the cropped look on neos it just doesnt look right. But it sure is hard to find

[avaloniaboerboele]

what is the bite psi of these dogs

Insert one forearm and observe........one become two!!

[Guest Anonymous]

Anonymous napisał(a):

what is the bite psi of these dogs?

I have read that they don't "bite hard" so their psi is probably not as large as the APBT is.

[gooeydog]

I have read that they don't "bite hard" so their psi is probably not as large as the APBT is.

How nice... You read that they don't "bite hard", so you're going to assume that in all cases an APBT will inflict a more powerful bite then a Neopolitan Mastiff? That's absurd. Any dog, if pushed to the point where it feels the need, will bite hard. Also, you can talk about "accurate PSI measurements" all day, but you can't do anything to make them accurate. Consider that when a dog bites a person, first they jump "into" them as they bite, then in most cases they pull back while holding onto them. (notice that I said a bite, meaning that the dog is serious, not just playing or a warning.) It would seem to me that a larger, heavier dog going through those motions would, in most cases, cause more injury than a smaller, lighter dog going through those motions. In addition, you would also have to consider the drives the dogs were in at the time of the test. Different dogs bite differently at different times. There are just too many variables to accurately measure a dog's biting power.

[Guest Anonymous]

Hey just because I responded with "I read they don't bite hard" why can't you people let other people post their comments without all the negativity? These are open forums where people are entitled to their own opinion no matter what the rest of you people may think if you don't like the posts posted to the forums then don't bother reading them, leave, or just ignore them. After all you don't need to make such a fuss over one person's comment cos no matter what any of you people may think or post about what you people would describe as "stupid comments" your opinions are not going to change what people think or what they want to believe.

[deepseasnake]

no one called you stupid nor your comments stupid but please see it from our side, we get the same 5 questions asked all our lives about the same five dogs, so it's just a bit frusterating when all people care about is "lock jaws" and bite "PSI" these dogs have so many more powerful facits like their love and devotion for family and children. So please understand that we are not coming down on you, we are coming down on the fact that the world has turned these wonderful dogs into psi driven lock jaws and there is so much more to pitbulls and AMSTAFs

so please dont be offended just ask better questions before you ask about lock jaws and bite PSI. Because the other thing is how do we know your not gonna take the info we give you and go fight some dog because of it in that case we are just as responsible for killing a dog as you are (or would be, be that the case)

[gooeydog]

I thought you were the same guest who posts about bite PSI, trying to validate claims that certain breeds of dog are more dangerous than others (I think the same one as K is talking about). Sorry :oops: .

people are entitled to their own opinion no matter what the rest of you people may think if you don't like the posts posted to the forums then don't bother reading them, leave, or just ignore them

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but the opinion that you posted could cause a lot of harm to the breeds involved. The bite PSI myth is one of the biggest myths about "dangerous breeds", so people talking about it as if it were true/accurate can falsely influence other people's opinions. There was discussion going on about something that doesn't even exist (accurate testing of biting power), so some people pointed that out.

your opinions are not going to change what people think or what they want to believe.

Maybe not... but a lot of myths about "dangerous breeds" have been disspelled simply by sharing facts, educating people about the dogs, and letting them form their own opinions, based on what they see.

[Guest Anonymous]

Sorry if I sounded like a bitch but I thoght I was being helpful. Guess I'll have to ignore messages like that in the future.

[Guest Anonymous]

[quote name='Wendy'] your opinions are not going to change what people think or what they want to believe.

Wendy I am going to say one thing here and that is it...It is not meant to be rude or flaming but just to enlighten anyone... I believe opinions can change what peole think sometimes.. It maybe just 1 or 2 out of 10 but that maybe 2 dogs lives you save or 5 litters of puppies that are never born... You see if you approach a topic or a question or a comment and give facts and give the hard truth no matter how gruesome or horrible it is I feel you can get through to people sometimes.. People take in things if even just for a brief moment in time, they listen and take in information... and if you are clear and consise.. it maybe what you say that gets through.. You have to be reasonably nice and keep them reading.. You have to have all information on their point of view and why they feel the way they do... or else its useless... but then again some questions need no information...
Here is a story
A month ago in my town a man was shot dead by his cousin. They were fighting over who's Pit Bull's had the better bloodline, better bite, stronger, and etc... They though jaws locked(false).... They could tell you PSI...(which is false)..Who lost...the 4 female Pit's that were put down due to some idiot that knew nothing about a breed... A BETTER BLOODLINE for what???? Fighting?? there isn't one... I have seen pictures of dogs insides laying on the ground because my dogs has a bite like a bear... Well ya know what he is being put down know so you go tell him where that bite you brag about and encourage got him!! :cry:

I would love to see someone say look at this pic of a 4 yr old playing with a Neo or a Pit!!

[deepseasnake]

I wonder where the whole pitt fighting thing came from? why arn't the real fighting and war dogs being singled out like this? pitt have never been dog fighters before this century right? I'm not saying any breed SHOULD be singled out (accept Akitas :wink:) but how on earth did pitts get this wrap and not Shar Peis or Dogos or even Mastinos for that matter?
I dont get it :-?

[Guest Anonymous]

deepseasnake napisał(a):

I wonder where the whole pitt fighting thing came from? why arn't the real fighting and war dogs being singled out like this? pitt have never been dog fighters before this century right? I'm not saying any breed SHOULD be singled out (accept Akitas :wink:) but how on earth did pitts get this wrap and not Shar Peis or Dogos or even Mastinos for that matter?
I dont get it :-?

No me either but I remember when I was younger the police raided this farm which is about 5 miles away from where I live. Due to a tip off from someone who had claimed that there was a big organised illegal dog fight going to take place on one particular day. They seized something like 20 dogs, all Pitbulls, and arrested numerous people including the ringleader who organised the fight and who recieved a prison sentance for 7 years relating to the organised dog fight. Around 11 of these dogs had to be destroyed due to horrific injuries the dogs had suffered from previous fightts.

I don't know how it's always pits who get caught up in the whole dog fighting crap. Maybe it has something to with the fact they exude raw power and are fast. I don't condemn dog fighting as I think it is cruel and barbaric but I alway's read everything I can about the breeds that I love (all molossers) whether it be good or bad, and I have read that a Neo would be too slow when put against a true pitt dog. Whether this is true or not I don't know maybe I'm just guilable and read so much crap. But due the sheer size of the Neo I could probably believe that this is what would make the Neo slow and that's why they don't get the rap like pits do for fighting.

[deepseasnake]

well this is a hypothetical I have never thought of....
and I guess in a way you have a point, however Neos did fight in gladitorial games and did quite well. In fact they did so well they were used to battle just about anything the empire came across including the elephants of western asia and india, at least that is what I have read. So yes a pittbull weighing in at oh, 60 lbs would be much quicker than a 235lbs neo, but the carnal instinctive ability for battle of the Neo must be takin into account as well as the inane ability for the pitt bull to grab and hold cattle.
My original point was why would somebody want to see two 60 pound pittbulls fight when they could see acouple 200+ pound mastiffs fight? not to mention most mastiffs were used for fighting at some time anyway.
I dont see why we dont see Akita fighting rings, I'll bet in terms of heritage they were the most recent breed to lose their "fighter" title which would make it more fresh in their instincts.

I'm a big fan of WAR dogs but I do not condone dog fighting as we all know, but it is okay to think about hypotheticals, like if the taliban invaded with pitbulls, how would our dogs hold up in the battle :wink:

[Gordonmom]

Good afternoon guys.

Wendy stated: Your opinions are not going to change the way people think or what they believe:

I guess it all depends on if the listener tends to enter a conversation with his mind closed or open. Change does not always come easy, but it can come, just by enlightening one person at a time.

I always find discussions with people that are afraid of pits interesting. I ask them if they are afraid of chickens also. Cock fighting has been around longer than dog fighting and I think those people should be afraid of roosters also.

And as for fighting a pit rather than a Neo? I don't think human could give up the control, Even with two pits, their owners could do something to break up a fight---maybe. Two Neos?

You don't see many woman fighting dogs. In my opinion, it is men who feel lacking in their masculinity that try to make up for their weaknesses by having some dog that people are terrified of. It's my dog is better than your dog gone crazy. No inadequate man is going to try and make a poodle or spaniel be mean. But a big, muscular dog with a reputation, now that is cool for the insecure. The dog itself doesn't matter. Unfortunately these wackos ruin it for the rest of the people that just like big muscular dogs. Because it is only the people that need to counter their insecurity that are using their dog as a tool and not as a life long friend.

I would worry more about drowning in a Neo's slobber that his PSI.

[Guest Anonymous]

[quote name='"Mei-Mei"']I'm also going to start by saying I don't condone dog fighting, or cock fighting or any animal blood sports.

The reason pitbulls get the rap is because they have a great degree of a quality called tenacity. Pitbulls have been pitted against Neos and Tosas in the pit before, according to an author whose name I will have to find for you later. The dogs were not allowed to fight to the death and, according to the author, usually the pit 'won' the fight because it would not give up. Even though the other dogs are fighting dogs, they were not as tenacious as the pitbull seems to be.quote]

I also read something very similar which I am sure was entitled "The world's toughest dog" or "the world's greatest fighter" or something to that effect. I read it on Filanet when they were discussing pretty much what you mentioned Mei Mei and one of the conclusions they came to was the Chiuahua was the greatest/best as it was the smallest!

[Guest Anonymous]

Hey I have a paw at the side of my name. I always wondered how you got them. How much do I need to be a Dogomaniac?

[Guest Anonymous]

I can't really say much as I have only had one encounter with them and he was the sweetest dog I ever met. There was'nt a bad bone in his body and he was a beautiful white/smokey grey dog whom his owner aptly named him Smoke. Due to our strict BSL laws the owner of the dog had to comply with the law and have him neutered, muzzled and tattooed. The owner got heavily into drugs and was more interested in the drugs than the dog and sadly the dog had to be put down as it was against the law for the Pitbull to be rehomed.

[Guest Anonymous]

I am referring to the Pitbull in my last post. I should read my posts beffore sending them.

[deepseasnake]

well, I'll tell you what, if I could choose a personal gaurdian I would be much more likely to pick a Neo over a pitt.
by the way how long have pitts been fought?


Mei Mei said

Pitbulls have been pitted against Neos and Tosas in the pit before

I am very interested in this statement, if you do think of the authors name or preferably a website with this info I would like to check it out as it is contrary to my faith in Mastinos

[deepseasnake]

my last was not ment to be abrasive, you are just shattering one of my my foundational beliefs in the Mastino :(

[Guest Anonymous]

Here is the link to the article that I think Mei Mei is on about:

http://www.fila.org/libourel/index.html

[gooeydog]

I wonder where the whole pitt fighting thing came from? why arn't the real fighting and war dogs being singled out like this? pitt have never been dog fighters before this century right? I'm not saying any breed SHOULD be singled out (accept Akitas ) but how on earth did pitts get this wrap and not Shar Peis or Dogos or even Mastinos for that matter?

Pit bull type dogs have been used in dog fights since the late 1800s, and in other bloodsports before that. Of course, the pit bull type dogs of those times were somewhat different in appearance from those of today. Pit bull type dogs were originally created by crossing terriers with "bulldogs" (nothing like the bulldogs of today, they were taller, more functional dogs, which actually look a little like some ABs of today). I think (not sure though) the "bulldogs" were descendants of some of the mastiff-ish breeds. Now, as to why pit bulls have been singled out as "dangerous"... They're easier to get than most of the rarer gladiator breeds (many of them are expensive, and breeders are more selective about who gets them). Of course, more people are breeding those rarer breeds now, so I expect there will be more of them falling into the wrong hands. Pit bulls aren't a "pretty" breed to most people. They're not fluffy, many have pretty excessive musculature, which is intimidating.

Neos did fight in gladitorial games and did quite well.

Neos in those times. Poor breeding has brought a lot of problems to the Neo breed, as with many others. From what I understand, Neos back then were smaller, with less of the "typiness" Neos today have. Smaller animals have better agility and wind than larger ones, in general. Pit bulls were made to be a "utilitarian gladiator". They fought in the pit, but they also "earned their keep" performing other everyday tasks. They weren't to big, weren't too small, had agility, stamina, good wind, speed, power, loyalty. They've stayed similar to the way they were when the breed was created. Neos have changed a lot though. I think a Neo could have beaten a pit bull in a fight when Neos were in their "original state", but the present day Neos might have a harder time. It would really depend on the individual dogs. A Neo might defeat a pit bull before the pit's gameness could ever come into play. If a pit bull could keep from sustaining fatal injury early in the fight, the Neo would probably lose power as exhaustion set in. It's kind of like a heavyweight boxer taking on a lightweight (not sure if that's what they're called) boxer.

Why would somebody want to see two 60 lb pit bulls fight when they could see two 200 lb mastiffs fight?

I think it all comes down to a trait pit bulls have that not many other breeds have... gameness. Most dogs will stop doing something (ie: fighting) if they are sustaining serious injury from it. Maybe not right away, but at some point self preservation will kick in and they'll try to get out of the situation. Not many dogs will fight for hours in a ring, with serious, sometimes fatal injuries, just because they don't want to quit. It's the kind of quality the people who attend dog fights wish they themselves had. Kind of the same as parents who live through their children.

[deepseasnake]

that was a very interesting article, unfortunatly dog fighting is quite the sport isn't it

well I have decided to look more at the origin of the Mastino. I liked the article but I now feel I may be able to get closer to the ancient roman war dogs that attract me so much to the Mastino.
I would never fight a dog, but one of my biggest concerns is that I wont be there when my family or home needs a protector and I realize that dogs like dobies and GSD and ABs are great gaurd dogs, I need more comfort than that (its just one of my quirks). I feel that if I can get as close to the dogs that fought in the legendary wars of the past, they will protect my people with age old vigor and wisdom in the preasant. This is more for my own comfort than the reality that 100 to 1 nothing will ever happen. My other drive to find this dog is that a dog that has been in war for 3000 years will be most likely of stable mind and body. Therefore I will not run the risk of an unstable misinterpretation of a situation. so I will re embark on my quest to find my gaurd dog